When are lows dangerous

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When are lows dangerous


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Old 01-08-2014, 05:02   #1
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Default When are lows dangerous

I've had good numbers fasting and at 2 hr after eating for several days now mainly in the mid 70s-80s. I'm eating very few carbs and more fats. Generally I feel good on my new diet and went hiking yesterday up a steep mountainside and climbing up through some rock bands for about 2 1/2 hours. At that point we stopped and made some tea. I tested at 59, felt a bit hungry and a need for energy. I ate a banana, some nuts, and dried currents. I tested about half hour later and got 66.

About 15 minutes later we packed up and headed down. It was really steep and even down climbing required lots of energy. I do this often and am pretty much used to it, just not with my new very low carb diet.
After a fairly short time I start to feel hypoglycemic, a bit light headed and energy depleted so I stop on a rocky ledge and test. Now I'm at 46. I eat the rest of the dried currents, a piece of dried chili pineapple and mango and drink some water. I had less than a mile to go to get home. I felt OK but don't know that I want to get into this situation every time I hike.

I ate a sweet potato and beef steak and lots of spinach for dinner. 2 hr after dinner was 93. Today was normal.

I'm interested in your thoughts, advice. I'd like to keep the carbs low but need food to keep my BG in a safe and health range.

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Feb '18 Lab Results
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Chol 262
HDL 45
Trig 108
LDL 194
Insulin 4.7 (2.0-19.6)
11/15/17 30 Day FBG average 109


Male 68 157 lbs. 6'


Self diagnosed 11/'13, eating LCHF, Ketogenic. My Cardiologist is trying to help me manage my BG levels as I have no PCP
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Old 01-08-2014, 05:44   #2
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Well you might try not stopping at a LEDGE next time you feel low. LOL
I kinda get like that too, I bring a peanut sandwich and water just in case. I also eat something carby 15-30 mins before I hit the trail. On my fav hike I shoot for 120-130 at start and end up around 70 at the top then it levels out and numbers end up around 90-100 for the rest of the hike. You might want to bring some carbs just in case and test test text til you know what your body needs.

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Old 01-08-2014, 05:53   #3
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With what I eat pre-hike I know I would be in the 150-160 range or more if I didn't hit the trail when I do. So its eat, hop in the car, drive to the trailhead, check blood. 120-130...time to go before it goes up more. If I don't eat like that then I'm shaky at the top and in the 60s

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Old 01-08-2014, 05:57   #4
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You might be in the "low-carb zone of misery" that Peter Attia and others have talked about. This is where glucose has been reduced nicely via low-carb, but not quite sufficiently for your cells to really adapt to ketosis, meaning that they preferentially use ketones over glucose. Normally, "endurance" type activities like what you have described will not need glucose in a keto-adapted athlete. And since energy from fat is a virtually limitless source in your body endurance is actually greatly increased.

If, however, you are in the zone of misery, you will still be running mostly on glucose and your muscles will be demanding it. On fairly sedentary days, this will not be apparent. Your liver will simply make enough glucose from amino acids to keep all systems happy. This process will not be able to keep up, however, on an extended athletic activity.

This is where the difference between "low-carb" and dietary ketosis comes out. True ketosis is a lot harder than many people realize and for many people may not be necessary for great BG control. Therefore, they might not realize there is any difference until they try to climb a mountain.

Only a blood ketone meter will give the definitive answer - and it can be a surprising wake-up call.

Dr. Attia talks about measuring his long-distance bicycle rides in "bananas". When still running on glucose, he required a banana every few hours to keep going. Once fully keto-adapted, he could ride full-speed literally all day without eating anything with no negative consequences.

It's been a while since I read it, but if you Google [one banana ride] you can probably find it easily.

BTW, it's only a "zone of misery" if your trying to do endurance athletic feats. If you're sitting at a computer all day you probably won't know much difference. I'm in true ketosis sometimes and not other times. I do notice better overall activity and mental clarity when in true ketosis but I'm no endurance athlete and can thrive pretty well in either state.

In your position, I would definitely shoot for true keto-adaptation before climbing a mountain. But, you could probably do fine just judging that it's a "four-banana" mountain and proceeding accordingly.

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Old 01-08-2014, 15:28   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smorgan View Post
You might be in the "low-carb zone of misery" that Peter Attia and others have talked about. This is where glucose has been reduced nicely via low-carb, but not quite sufficiently for your cells to really adapt to ketosis...
Thanks, I do hike regularly and sometimes weekly. This hike I did was relatively short and easy. There is a trail head just over a mile from home to a peak, 8 mile round trip with over 4K' of elevation gain. I do many hikes from home and can be in the mountains in a 1/4 mile, so I do.

My breakfast on the day of hike was 2 eggs, some fried kale in butter, and 6 mini smoked sausages, coffee. Pretty much no carbs.

If going in ketosis what range will my BG be? Simply, what is the best way for me to be able to get into ketosis? I have 10-15 lbs I'd like to loose around the middle, back and chest. I weigh 182/6'.

Thanks!

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FBG
Chol 262
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Trig 108
LDL 194
Insulin 4.7 (2.0-19.6)
11/15/17 30 Day FBG average 109


Male 68 157 lbs. 6'


Self diagnosed 11/'13, eating LCHF, Ketogenic. My Cardiologist is trying to help me manage my BG levels as I have no PCP
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Old 01-08-2014, 15:49   #6
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Thanks for the explanation Salim!

Big Nick,

I'll let salim expalin ketosis, he'd do a much better job than me.

But you can also read books like

The Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Living: An Expert Guide to Making the Life-Saving Benefits of Carbohydrate Restriction Sustainable and Enjoyable: Stephen D. Phinney, Jeff S. Volek: 9780983490708: Amazon.com: Books

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Old 01-08-2014, 15:49   #7
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Hi bignick ,
Not sure what you are on to control your BS or weather you are T1or T2 ?

If you are on meds for control and going low carb you might need to consider adjusting them accordingly to go along with less in the way of carb consumption.

As far as the weight you want to loose if you continue with low carb the weight loss seems to just happen naturally.

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Old 01-08-2014, 16:10   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crankincraig View Post
Hi bignick ,
Not sure what you are on to control your BS or weather you are T1or T2 ?

If you are on meds for control and going low carb you might need to consider adjusting them accordingly to go along with less in the way of carb consumption.

As far as the weight you want to loose if you continue with low carb the weight loss seems to just happen naturally.
I have not been diagnosed officially as anything. My Doc noted my BG was 106 two years ago, and a bit higher my last blood test a few weeks ago. He asked that I get it tested again for a look within the next year.

I'm concerned and doing what I am without medical intervention. I'm eating less carbs, and testing repeatedly to attain healthy BG levels. I've never had diabetes to my knowledge, just maybe fasting high BG levels.

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Feb '18 A1c 5.2
Feb '18 Lab Results
FBG
Chol 262
HDL 45
Trig 108
LDL 194
Insulin 4.7 (2.0-19.6)
11/15/17 30 Day FBG average 109


Male 68 157 lbs. 6'


Self diagnosed 11/'13, eating LCHF, Ketogenic. My Cardiologist is trying to help me manage my BG levels as I have no PCP

Last edited by bignick; 01-08-2014 at 16:13.
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Old 01-08-2014, 16:20   #9
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Maybe uping your carbs when you know you are going to be exercising more. I do a great deal of hiking myself and it tends to lower my levels when I do. I always have a small snack within reach and pick a little at a time while walking , granola , nuts , dried fruit seem to work well for me. Not a lot but a few bites every so often throughout the day. I would be more concerned about being low in the woods by myself ( most of the time , I enjoy the quiet time) than having my sugar slightly elevated from a snack.

Hope you get it figured out.

Be safe out there.

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Old 02-02-2014, 21:40   #10
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I could be wrong, but as far as DANGER... well except for the danger of getting weak and dizzy and falling off a cliff... as far as I know for a type 2 or pre diabetic NOT on insulin.. ive never heard of one getting so low that they would actually be in danger from the blood sugar itself. but again, the cliff thing....hehe.

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