Pins & Needles between Toes

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Pins & Needles between Toes


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Old 04-15-2012, 07:40   #1
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Default Pins & Needles between Toes

Anyone have pins & needles pain between toes? Dx 2 weeks ago as pre-diabtic, waiting for all test results yet. For years I have had occasional pins & needles pain in between my toes and in my eyes. Docs tested me several time for diabetes and tests all came back negative.

A year ago I did a liver cleanse which was too hard on my body....gallbladder, pancreas, spleen enlarged, kidneys in pain, high blood pressure which I had never had before. Nuerologist felt I had a toxicty from the cleanse. After the cleanse I started having intense pins & needles pain between my toes, lots of pain in my feet, amny episodes of blurred vision. Went on a gluten-free diet which did help amny of my symptoms but still had the pins and needles and numbness in the legs/feet below the knee.

Docs have been searching for an answer, found I do have 2 bulging discs in my back. Once treated the sciatic pain went away but everything else remained.

I am also being checked fro vitamin deficiencies.

However, my question here is can a pre-diabetic have pins and needles pain/numbess like I am describing? My 2 hour glucose test showed glucose levels at 171. I have bought a meter which has not been to reliable but the readings I have received are showing a slight rise in my glucose levels in the mornings when I wake.

Currently I restricting all carbs, waiting for my new meter and giving my pancreas a chance to mend.

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Old 04-15-2012, 12:36   #2
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Diabetic Neuropathy is only one type of neuropathy. Many other things can cause it. When you have very high bgs ( over 140) for an extended amount of time the nerve endings can get coated with sugar. It is this glycation or sugar coating that cuts off the blood supply to our extremities. They measure glycation with the HbA1c test. I had a lot of tingling in my feet pre diabetes but my HbA1c was in the 10's when I was dx'd. Now that you are watching carbs and testing try to keep fastings below 100 and after meal no higher than 120-140.

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Old 04-15-2012, 13:03   #3
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Thank you for the reply. My resting test have been slightly higher than 100. Perhaps this is part of the problem. I am hoping my tests will give more answers when the results come back.

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Old 04-15-2012, 13:22   #4
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You'll get a better picture of how your meals affect your BG during the day when you start testing after meals. The fasting(resting) BG is only one part of the whole. The A1C will also tell you the average BG during the last 30 days. But your own testing after meals will give you the best information.

I have read reports on this forum of tingling and other signs of neuropothy reversing once the member's BG stays under 140 for an extended period of time - months or maybe a year.

I have a lot of sympathy for you in your journey to try to recover from the cleanse.

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Old 04-15-2012, 14:31   #5
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I agree testing 2 hours after meals is very important. If you have a reduced insulin out put your bgs could be soaring after meals but return to normal overnight. Usually the fasting numbers are the last to rise. But your neuropathy could be caused my other things. Everything is not Diabetes related.

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Old 04-15-2012, 17:25   #6
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I dislike this illusion that if one keeps their blood sugar below 140 mg/dL, one will avoid the ravages of excess glycation. This can only be true if one does not consume any food/drink containing sucrose ( table sugar ) or HFCS. If HFCS is consumed, then for example, starting BS is 80 mg/dL and is raised to 140 mg/dL by HFCS, then the glycating power is ( 3 x 60 ) + 80 or about 260 mg/dL equivalent glycating power, so if you are a Pima Indian then you will most likely go blind in a few years if you continue using products with HFCS or sucrose at this level. Some guru claimed that one should only consume 15 grams of fructose a day. Am I wrong?

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Old 04-15-2012, 17:56   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColaJim View Post
I dislike this illusion that if one keeps their blood sugar below 140 mg/dL, one will avoid the ravages of excess glycation. This can only be true if one does not consume any food/drink containing sucrose ( table sugar ) or HFCS. If HFCS is consumed, then for example, starting BS is 80 mg/dL and is raised to 140 mg/dL by HFCS, then the glycating power is ( 3 x 60 ) + 80 or about 260 mg/dL equivalent glycating power, so if you are a Pima Indian then you will most likely go blind in a few years if you continue using products with HFCS or sucrose at this level. Some guru claimed that one should only consume 15 grams of fructose a day. Am I wrong?
Yes, fructose certainly deserves attention and caution. But, so does glucose. The use of glucose for energy is far and away the major source of methylglyoxal. So glucose THROUGHPUT is probably way more important than excess glucose in the blood which we measure. The more glucose you metabolize, the more MG is produced. (It has a few other sources, but they are trivial compared to this one.)

MG is 10,000 more potent an agent of glycation than glucose itself and is implicated in complications of diabetes, especially kidney damage. So, if you "manipulate" your timing and quantities of food just to keep BG under 140 or under 120 but are still utilizing lots of glucose and relying on it for cellular energy (which you ARE if you are not in ketosis), you may have done very little to forestall complications.

Here is one of many studies (summary) on the subject.

Quote:
There are a number a ways in which methylglyoxal is thought to contribute to diabetic nephropathy. The non-enzymatic glycation hypothesis of diabetic complications proposes that chemically reactive sugars (including glucose and the a- oxoaldehydes) and resulting advanced glycation end-products (AGEs) lead to tissue damage as seen in diabetes (Brownlee, 1992). Methylglyoxal reacts with amino groups of proteins, nucleic acid and phospholipids up to 10 000 times more readily than glucose does (Beisswenger et al., 2003).These glycation reactions of methylglyoxal with amino acids can induce oxidative stress and free radical generation, implicating them in the development of chronic complications such as nephropathy, retinopathy, and neuropathy in diabetic patients (Baynes and Thorpe, 1999).
Also, here (nerdier).

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Old 04-15-2012, 19:04   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smorgan View Post
Yes, fructose certainly deserves attention and caution. But, so does glucose. The use of glucose for energy is far and away the major source of methylglyoxal. So glucose THROUGHPUT is probably way more important than excess glucose in the blood which we measure. The more glucose you metabolize, the more MG is produced. (It has a few other sources, but they are trivial compared to this one.)

MG is 10,000 more potent an agent of glycation than glucose itself and is implicated in complications of diabetes, especially kidney damage. So, if you "manipulate" your timing and quantities of food just to keep BG under 140 or under 120 but are still utilizing lots of glucose and relying on it for cellular energy (which you ARE if you are not in ketosis), you may have done very little to forestall complications.

Here is one of many studies (summary) on the subject.



Also, here (nerdier).
ColaJim & Smorgon, this is way over my head. I do not understand the lingo. Can you explain in more simplified terms?

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Old 04-15-2012, 19:37   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AVR1962 View Post
ColaJim & Smorgon, this is way over my head. I do not understand the lingo. Can you explain in more simplified terms?
Just saying ... There is a lot more to Metabolic Syndrome (T2DM) than just blood sugar readings.

ColaJim

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