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-   -   What we don't know about dieting (https://www.diabetesforum.com/diabetes-diet-nutrition/99211-what-we-dont-know-about-dieting.html)

itissteve 04-24-2019 17:22

What we don't know about dieting
 
Well, it seems that most of us here know something in rejecting the advice about low-calorie food. A look at the inadequacy of the calorie as a measure of what food does to us and for us:

Quote:

“It sounds simple but I decided to listen to my body and eat whenever I was hungry but only when I was hungry, and to eat real food, not food ‘products’,” he says. He went back to items that he’d long banned himself from eating. He had his first rasher of bacon in three years and enjoyed cheese, whole-fat milk and steaks.

He immediately felt less hungry and happier. More surprising, he quickly began to lose his extra fat.
Death of the Calorie?

Runnerguy 04-24-2019 17:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by itissteve (Post 1318807)
Well, it seems that most of us here know something in rejecting the advice about low-calorie food. A look at the inadequacy of the calorie as a measure of what food does to us and for us:







Death of the Calorie?



This isn’t a case study, it’s the unsubstantiated claim of one person in an economics magazine.


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itissteve 04-24-2019 17:57

The article is not billed as a peer-reviewed metastudy. It is a (IMHO well-reasoned) suggestion that calories, as they currently are measured, provide a gross oversimplification of human nutrition, and the author urges more study.

Looking at how many people here succeed in improving their health with some diets and not with others and the success many here have not only in limiting what they eat (low-carb, dairy-free, etc.) but when (IF, OMAD, etc.), I'd say the guy was on to something.

What are your particular objections to the article?

Runnerguy 04-24-2019 20:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by itissteve (Post 1318811)
The article is not billed as a peer-reviewed metastudy. It is a (IMHO well-reasoned) suggestion that calories, as they currently are measured, provide a gross oversimplification of human nutrition, and the author urges more study.

Looking at how many people here succeed in improving their health with some diets and not with others and the success many here have not only in limiting what they eat (low-carb, dairy-free, etc.) but when (IF, OMAD, etc.), I'd say the guy was on to something.

What are your particular objections to the article?


No personal objections, of course.

The article, in addition to its discussion of calories, also suggests that bacon (processed meat) is somehow harmless. Meat can be part of a very healthy diet, but several peer-reviewed studies show that processed meat consumption should be limited:

https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/100/3/948/4576576

https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/articl...1/386S/4576503

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25030780

.

VeeJay 04-24-2019 21:41

My understanding of what I read about bacon several years ago is that it's the processing and addition of nitrites/nitrates that makes bacon less healthy. Since I buy nitrite/nitrate free bacon, I'm not troubled about eating it. Same with deli meat - get it at the healthfood store and rarely eat commercially processed.

I am one who succeeded with forgetting about calorie intake. As long as I keep carbs low (from leafy green and cabbage family veggies) and protein moderate, I can eat all the fatty foods I want and still lose extra weight. And I'm never hungry or feel deprived when I stick to this LCHF way of eating. I'm old enough to have tried many, many, many diets in my lifetime for weight loss and failed just about as many. I'll never go back to that yo-yo lifestyle.

I did not read the article, just responding to the topic.

With so many success stories here on the forum over the years, I'm more inclined to want to ask - how is it working for YOU. And then, how is it working for ME. This carries more weight than articles on blogs - although interesting.

xring 04-25-2019 20:48

I bought into the "Calories" thing for years, dealing with a weight problem for almost half of my 66 years (405 lbs in my 20's). I've realized that the source of the calories is more important than the number of calories. After all, calories are simply units of heat that some scientist decided could be used to determine the energy value of a food.
What worked for me was not limiting portions; but limiting processed foods - foods with many ingredients - anything made with flour, any type of chip, bread, pasta, grains, etc. It's not possible to get too many calories from fruits & vegetables.

mbuster 04-26-2019 05:40

I liked the article, it is thought provoking, but the author kind of ruins the finale storyline about maybe our thinking has been wrong for a while about calories, but includes insinuation that saturated fats have always been and still are bad. What if that thinking is wrong too, I wonder has the subject person in the story pondered that idea?

Some of the thoughts provoked so far from this thread:

Quickly absorbed sugars vs slowly absorbed sugars, is that a similarity to quickly absorbed toxins and slowly absorbed toxins? Does "slowly" imply good?

Processed red meat is found to be bad, unprocessed red meat is found NOT to be bad. Processed meat, hmmm, what does that mean? What is it processed with, some of those good carbs?

Made me want to google "nitrite/nitrate free" bacon. Now I wish I hadn't.

Nothing will ever convince me that too much fruit is a good thing if too much fructose is a bad thing.

I'll probably ponder some more later, but right now its getting late and giving me a headache.

itissteve 04-26-2019 14:10

The main point of the item for me was that people should challenge long-traditionally-accepted notions about nutrition because we know relatively little about it.

Lots of us here have confounded the "conventional wisdom" of managing diabetes with the standard American diabetic diet and even weight loss and cardiac health with low-fat diets. Addressing the deficiencies of a 19th-century measure of the value of foods is another step in that re-examination.

I do have differences of opinion with the author. I, too, agree that there can be "too many" calories from fructose, but I will admit that being diabetic affects my thinking about that. I'd rather not get stuck on those smaller issues and stay with the article's main ideas that nutrition is far more specific to individuals than it is treated now and that we should learn much more about how food nourishes our bodies.

smorgan 04-26-2019 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Runnerguy (Post 1318815)
No personal objections, of course.

The article, in addition to its discussion of calories, also suggests that bacon (processed meat) is somehow harmless. Meat can be part of a very healthy diet, but several peer-reviewed studies show that processed meat consumption should be limited:

https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/100/3/948/4576576

https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/articl...1/386S/4576503

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25030780

.


There's another very good reason to avoid bacon - and all pork products for that matter - they have very poorly balanced fats which are too high in Omega-6 PUFA. (Whether "processed" or not).

xring 04-27-2019 04:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by smorgan (Post 1318881)
There's another very good reason to avoid bacon - and all pork products for that matter - they have very poorly balanced fats which are too high in Omega-6 PUFA. (Whether "processed" or not).

Isn't that why pigs only look sexy to other pigs?


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