Why don't all obese people develop diabetes? - Page 3

corn_pops · 12-20-2012, 15:16

This is a mistery, but I do agree with Shanny, I think diabetic boom comes from excess of carbs no matter if they,re proccesed or "healthy" ones. Plenty of people (and doctors too) make me laugh when they said phrases like "there are 2 types of sugar, the good ones which comes from fresh fruits and the bad ones which comes from candy bars, ice cream, etc". The reality is "good sugar" doesn,t exists, sugar is sugar and that,s how our bodies treat it no matter where the source comes from. I discover I have fatty liver in 2010 on an ultrasound, on that time I weigthed 145 pounds (I am 5.6 feet), so I was thin and in a healthy BMI, the doctor was surprised and ask me "are you diabetic??" I said no, and he was like shock because he said to me, you have fatty liver and since you,re not fat I was thinking that maybe you have it because you were diabetic.

So, I am the type of person with "fat organs" but normal weight body. I recognize that on 2010 I ate plenty of junk high fat carbs food, so for me, I think the problem with my fatty liver comes from that. I have reduce intake of Omega 6 , I take Omega 3 pills daily, eat low carb stuff, sometimes brown whole-grains food, because having fat on the liver is not a problem, the problem start if the liver gets inflamed (having fat inside the liver increase a lot the chance of it to become inflamed), if I don,t take care of my fatty organ I will develop diabetes on the long run...and that,s what I,m trying to avoid since a few years now. Also fatty liver if not taken care of, can turn in chirrosis or liver cancer and I don,t want to have either of those either.

rudeboysti · 12-20-2012, 22:01

I think it was genetic predisposition activated by environmental toxins for me. I grew up in a farming community where meat came wrapped in paper rather than plastic wrap. We did eat a lot of corn and potatoes but it was always bought at the farmers market. I have been working out in some capacity since I was probably 14. I was an amateur boxer who's idea of a good time was jumping rope and running the railroad tracks.

I worked a lot of crap jobs dealing with all kinds of chemicals though. From working in a pork processing plant to painting bridges at the DOT. I have a lot of exposure to all sorts of industrial and automotive chemicals. On the bridge crew we used to clean up with MEK. I mean that we would fill a bucket with MEK and take shop towels and wipe the paint and grease and grime from our hands, arms and face with it. We also used MEK to kill poison oak by scratching open the blisters and holding an MEK soaked rag over the open blisters for a few minutes. Killed it dead by next day. Been in ammonia spills that caused my eyes to peel. Breathed in more than my fair share of exhaust fumes and brake dust. The garage I learned how to work on cars in was heated by used automotive oil. It would stink something awful until you got used to it after an hour or so. Had every automotive chemical known to man on me at some point. Breathing lots of solvents for cleaning guns. You name it and I have probably been over exposed to it. Never thought about it back then. I was indestructible. Now I think it was a large part in trigger my D. No wonder I have cancer.

Gizmo · 12-21-2012, 09:20

Guess I'll stick my 2 cents in here, too. My grandmother put out a full spread every meal. Besides meat and veggies she always had potatoes and gravy, home made breads, and desserts twice a day. They ate very high carb all of their lives, over 80 yrs. but never got diabetes, and I personally never knew anyone from that generation who had it.

In the past 20 yrs. (probably more), in order to appeal to farmers, wheat has been messed with to become more insect resistant, more disease resistant, make it need less nitrogen to grow, and to require less pesticide. Even though it looks and tastes the same, who knows what they have done to it. All I know is, now when my friends and family reach their 40's, most of them come down with it.

Well, whether or not wheat has anything to do with it, I wish to heck they'd stop playing with our food.

smorgan · 12-21-2012, 11:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gizmo

Guess I'll stick my 2 cents in here, too. My grandmother put out a full spread every meal. Besides meat and veggies she always had potatoes and gravy, home made breads, and desserts twice a day. They ate very high carb all of their lives, over 80 yrs. but never got diabetes, and I personally never knew anyone from that generation who had it.

In the past 20 yrs. (probably more), in order to appeal to farmers, wheat has been messed with to become more insect resistant, more disease resistant, make it need less nitrogen to grow, and to require less pesticide. Even though it looks and tastes the same, who knows what they have done to it. All I know is, now when my friends and family reach their 40's, most of them come down with it.

Well, whether or not wheat has anything to do with it, I wish to heck they'd stop playing with our food.

Yes, and don't forget how they played with our MINDS, too, and drastically modified what we eat. During that same period (and slightly before it - things take time to manifest), many other things happened:

1) Most of that highly nutritious meat you mentioned was replaced with chicken, fish and soy products. This, and some other changes, brought about a big shift in fats consumed. Saturated fats went way down and polyunsaturated (nearly all Omega 6) shot way up. This is consistently hidden from view in most studies and statistics because they just lump SFA, PUFA and even trans-fats into a single category even though those are drastically different things and the biggest changes were WITHIN the categories, not so much the total "fat".

2) Man-made trans-fats (not to be confused with natural ones such as one found in dairy which is extremely beneficial and healthy) were introduced to our planet for the first time ever and infiltrated the food chain in a HUGE way. Butter consumption fell for 50 years in favor of trans-fat containing margarine and other products.

3) Sugar consumption, along with the newly-invented HFCS absolutly skyrocketed. This not only hugely increased the role of glucose and carbs generally in the diet but also introduced unhealthy amounts of fructose, which is directly lined to fatty liver and insulin resistance, the beginnings of T2 diabetes.

4) The irrational fear of "fat" caused an increased role for sugar and other carbs in our "pyramid". "Healthy whole grains" and all that. Much of what "fat" remained was Omega 6-heavy PUFAs.

So, yes, I believe that wheat, its modification and its increased consumption is definitely among the suspects but I think each of the above are much bigger ones. Statistically, all are CLEARLY correllated with the diabetes epidemic.

There are also several cases of one or more of them being reversed causing a decrease in diabetes and other "diseases of civilization", such as a large population study in India where people left modern seed oils and switched back to traditional high-saturated-fat oils like ghee and coconut oil. The result was large decreases in diabetes and other maladies without any other major change in diet or lifestyle.

If you are at risk for diabetes or already have it, I'd suggest three things IMMEDIATELY:

1) Eliminate trans-fat from your diet COMPLETELY.
2) Eliminate fructose from all sources or reduce it to less than 5g per day.
3) Eliminate all ultra-high Omega 6 oils (basically ALL the vegetable oils) and get your PUFAs only from primarily SFA sources like red meat fat which contain more than enough PUFA along with the SFA for dietary needs.
4) Restore healthy, natural saturated fat to your diet. Fear of it is the MAIN thing that got us here.
5) Reduce the total role of carbs to 10% of calories or less, especially if you already have diabetes.
6) Eat only normal amounts of protein which is about 10 - 15% of total calories depending on age, activity level, etc.

If you do all this you won't even need to scarf fish oil. It is mainly "needed" by the population right now because it is something of an antidote to the inflammation-causing Omega 6 PUFAs which we've gone crazy with.

Not only do all things correllate with the diabetes epidemic, but there are clear biochemical paths for causality. The wheat thing is scary for sure, but the causality part is less clear beyond the simple carb content of wheat and other grains.

Your grandmother's "spread", in spite of the bread and potatoes was in many way much closer to what I'm saying here than the "healthy" food most eat today. Certainly it was much lower in trans-fats and PUFAs and higher in healthy saturated fats.

corn_pops · 12-21-2012, 19:26

Quote:

3) Eliminate all ultra-high Omega 6 oils (basically ALL the vegetable oils) and get your PUFAs only from primarily SFA sources like red meat fat which contain more than enough PUFA along with the SFA for dietary needs.

What type of oil is the one which has less Omega 6??. Unfortunately, 99.9% of oil I see here on the market, all of them are vegetable oils. Olive oils are very expensive, so I don,t buy them. I don,t have coconut oit available either, I have saw grape oil but I don,t know how much Omega 6 those have.

What type of oil you buy to try to avoid or at least reduce the Omega 6 intake. Since plenty of food (specially meat) comes with Omega 6 already.

David Burke · 12-21-2012, 19:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by corn_pops

What type of oil is the one which has less Omega 6??. Unfortunately, 99.9% of oil I see here on the market, all of them are vegetable oils. Olive oils are very expensive, so I don,t buy them. I don,t have coconut oit available either, I have saw grape oil but I don,t know how much Omega 6 those have.

What type of oil you buy to try to avoid or at least reduce the Omega 6 intake. Since plenty of food (specially meat) comes with Omega 6 already.

Do you have an aversion to butter? That's the simplest solution I can think of outside of eliminating cooking oils.

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Daytona · 12-21-2012, 19:48

Or use lard. I save and strain my meat drippings and keep them in the refrigerator to use when cooking.

corn_pops · 12-21-2012, 23:59

I,m ok with butter, I like it and all that, but I don,t know if it will be very yummy to fried meat on butter

I fried a lot on lunch time only, since breakfast and dinner I eat canned tuna, fresh veggies or brown whole-grain bread with cheese. I am currently losing weight, slowly but it is getting down.

I don,t know were I can find lard, maybe if I fried pork chop alone I can have some lard??? Does coconut oil has Omega 6 or not? I don,t find any coconut oil here but, I do find shredded coconut (the white thing that comes inside the coconut) can I make coconut oil with that???.

I haven,t had any liver enzymes blood test since like 10 months already, but I remember my last liver enzyme ALT/AST blood test both where less than 15 (normal range is between 5-45) , and I was eating plenty of Omega 6 oil but also 1 pill daily of 1000 mg Omega 3 oil. I didn,t know in that time, Omega 6 was a killer....if I decrease Omega 6 too much, but I still take Omega 3 pills does this will cause some damage? since I,m confused, and I read that Omega 6 and Omega 3 need to be supplied together to our body.

David Burke · 12-22-2012, 01:16

Pork chops don't really give off too much as far as rendered fat, you'd be better served, quantity wise with bacon. The ticker and fattier the cut the better. Save the grease from frying bacon and you can use it lots of ways from seasoning veggies to making bacon fudge.

As far as the omega 3/6 questions, ill have to defer to someone like MCS or smorgan for those. Those guys are really on the ball for those type questions.

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corn_pops · 12-22-2012, 01:37

Bacon of course!! I don,t know why I haven,t consider or think of that before. I can fried Bacon with butter, that will bring some oil for me to save

I,m very interested to bring down bad cholesterol since is very relate to fatty liver, also at least 70% of people with type 2 diabetes have fatty liver and don,t know it. Even if I know i would never eat 0% of Omega 6 even if I cut all vegetetable oil, since Omega 6 is on meat too and brown bread and oatmeal, etc. Not as high as the vegetable oil, but it is there. But how much is too much, that,s the question.