Overcoming The Dawn Phenomenon - Page 4

Go Back   The Diabetes Forum Support Community For Diabetics Online > Diabetes Forum Community > Diabetes Treatment

Diabetes Treatment As there is currently no cure for the chronic, Diabetes mellitus – the emphasis must be on treatment and management to avoid complications. Please use this section to discuss how you carefully control and manage your Diabetes. Please let us know what is and isn’t working for you. Feel free to discuss all areas of treatment and management of Diabetes including diet, exercise, weight loss, insulin usage, oral drugs and more.


Like Tree101Likes

Overcoming The Dawn Phenomenon - Page 4


Closed Thread
 
Shared Thread Thread Tools
Old 08-14-2016, 01:53   #31
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Bay Area - US
Posts: 128

Member Type
Type 2
Diagnosed in 2008

51 likes received
137 likes given
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve3129 View Post
I test about 6:30 a.m. and inject about 10:30 p.m. My numbers with 25 units has run between 102 and 125. I have not checked during the night but have had no symptoms of a hypo.
So that's 8 hours between the injection and your FBG measurement. What time do you eat at night, and what do you eat in terms of carbs, protein, and fat?

Do you measure again after your FBG reading?

Papa Diva is offline  
Old 08-16-2016, 04:31   #32
Senior Member
 
Steve3129's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Memphis, TN, USA
Posts: 799

Member Type
Type 2
Diagnosed in 2008

1058 likes received
1205 likes given
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Papa Diva View Post
So that's 8 hours between the injection and your FBG measurement. What time do you eat at night, and what do you eat in terms of carbs, protein, and fat?

Do you measure again after your FBG reading?
I eat at 6:00 p.m. generally and limit myself to 10 carbs or less per meal. I don't measure again until lunch and generally I'm below 100 then and also at dinner time.

I know its my wonderful liver that is dumping glucose in the morning which Metformin is supposed to handle. I guess the liver has been doing the same thing for so many years it doesn't know when to stop!

I've kept injecting 25 units at night and my FBG ranges from 103 to 120 generally averaging maybe 113... not bad but not what I would like to see in the morning which is below 100!

Bunjee, Papa Diva and skypeace like this.
Steve3129 is offline  
Old 08-16-2016, 19:58   #33
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Minneapolis, USA
Posts: 799

Member Type
Type LADA
Diagnosed in 2011

555 likes received
273 likes given
Default

DCE suggested yesterday to try eating a single cracker or two grapes in the early morning to see if that will satisfy the liver. I typically wake up between 2 and 3, so not something I would have to specially set an alarm for. I'm going to try that for a couple of early mornings to see if that makes any difference in the DP.

Also, I just found out that I have above normal iron. Perhaps that is influencing my blood sugar. Don't know how that works, but am investigating.

skypeace likes this.
__________________
T2 since 2011; LADA 2016
A1C 7.9 5/1/16 <---before MDI
6.9 1/9/17
6.6 3/9/17 & 6/15/17
MDI - May 2016
LCHF started 6/22/17
Bunjee is offline  
 
Old 08-16-2016, 20:44   #34
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 146

Member Type
Type 2
Diagnosed in 2015

153 likes received
179 likes given
Default

I take it back. I am back up to 100 and 110 every morning. ☹️

skypeace likes this.
Taso is offline  
Old 08-21-2016, 03:57   #35
Senior Member
 
kyteflyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Newcastle, Australia
Posts: 725

Member Type
Type 2
Diagnosed in 2006

838 likes received
2462 likes given
Default

My endo said, when I was first starting out on Lantus, to increase the Lantus by 2 units every 3 days, until the morning reading was between 5 and 6. That was before I began using Novorapid. But she prescribed that only for when I am having significant carbs with meals.

I tried to get those numbers down only with Lantus and it was just fruitless. In the end I was on 98 units a day and that just seemed excessive, so I decided to bite the bullet and start using the Novorapid as prescribed. It seems to work for me, and I've been able to reduce my Lantus now to 70 units a day and still reducing.

Seems to me its all a matter of balance. I just havent quite found mine yet, because I still crave carbs after being low carb for a few weeks and then I "bust".

skypeace likes this.
__________________
Sue
kyteflyer is offline  
Old 08-21-2016, 04:22   #36
Senior Member
 
kyteflyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Newcastle, Australia
Posts: 725

Member Type
Type 2
Diagnosed in 2006

838 likes received
2462 likes given
Default

And just as a matter of interest, after waking to a 6.2 today, it seems I had a belated DP after my nap, when I managed an 8.4, without having eaten anything. Rapidcalc told me I needed 17u/s of Novorapid so lets see how we go.

__________________
Sue
kyteflyer is offline  
Old 08-22-2016, 13:12   #37
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Houston USA
Posts: 105

Member Type
Type Pre
Diagnosed in 2008

77 likes received
138 likes given
Default

I go to bed with an 80 reading and wake up to a 95-100. I've been on lchf pretty strictly for about 2 yrs. I'd thought about metformin but doubt my pcp would prescribe it with those numbers. I'd love to have fasting in the 80's. It happens seldom.

skypeace likes this.
soapluvr is offline  
Old 08-22-2016, 16:46   #38
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Minneapolis, USA
Posts: 799

Member Type
Type LADA
Diagnosed in 2011

555 likes received
273 likes given
Default

126 - It was about 151 when I went to bed last night (glass of milk), so I was pleasantly surprised that it was LOWER when I woke up since this hasn't been the case since I dropped metformin. Especially interesting is that this is occuring AFTER I reduced my Novolog use (instead of set amounts, I now use ratio against carbs to be consumed).

[LCHF folks...avert your eyes!!] OK, after today, I am past all the birthday party cake, meals and treats. For those of you who eat birthday cake, I could use 10u of Novolog to cover cake and ice cream, but 10u do not cover cake alone. More proof that FAT helps to slow and lower the spike. Anyway, no more birthdays until December, so no more cake.

soapluvr, I would tend to agree with you that your doc probably wouldn't give you metformin since you don't go above 100. But, maybe a 250 mg dosage (you can split the regular metformin) might be acceptable. The current belief among doctors is that metformin provides a protective benefit over and above reducing sugar dump from liver. Unlike all the other meds, metformin doesn't typically give lows, which is defined by the endo as anything below 80 in my case.

skypeace likes this.
__________________
T2 since 2011; LADA 2016
A1C 7.9 5/1/16 <---before MDI
6.9 1/9/17
6.6 3/9/17 & 6/15/17
MDI - May 2016
LCHF started 6/22/17
Bunjee is offline  
Old 09-05-2016, 23:08   #39
Active Member
 
Annageckos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 74

Member Type
Type 1
Diagnosed in 1989

71 likes received
72 likes given
Default

I've been having issues with DP. I've been T1 since I was six, and over the years kind of slacked. But I know I now need to have better control over my sugars and I'm really trying. It has actually been going pretty good other than in the mornings. I wake with great sugar readings but don't normally eat for a couple hours. By the time I test for breakfast my sugar has gone up. And it seems to take more insulin to bring it down if the reading is higher than I like when I first wake.
This morning I woke at 6am with 111(that is really good for me) but by 8, my sugar was 178. I didn't eat anything in that time, and I was hesitant to take any insulin. It seems to raise around 60-75 points if I take no insulin when I wake. And if I do take some insulin (if it's over 140) it only lowers it by 5-15 points. But the same amount of insulin would drop my sugar later in the day.
It just is confusing and frustrating, I'm not really sure what to do or where to start.

Annageckos is offline  
Old 09-05-2016, 23:59   #40
Moderator
 
Daytona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 2,665

Member Type
Type 2
Diagnosed in 2010

3089 likes received
2882 likes given
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annageckos View Post
I wake with great sugar readings but don't normally eat for a couple hours. By the time I test for breakfast my sugar has gone up. And it seems to take more insulin to bring it down if the reading is higher than I like when I first wake.
I experience the same thing. At the moment I chase my DP every morning with corrections. I've gotten pretty good at bringing a high fasting back down to 100-120 and keeping it there, though it takes over twice the amount of insulin than I take when correcting in the evening.

When I get a CGM, I'm going to use it to figure out if I can increase my nightly basal to help with this. I'd prefer to wake up under 140. If it keeps up, or it's clear that the spike is starting late in the morning I plan on getting a pump, so that I can set a higher basal rate from 4am - 11am.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Annageckos View Post
This morning I woke at 6am with 111(that is really good for me) but by 8, my sugar was 178. I didn't eat anything in that time, and I was hesitant to take any insulin.
Obviously I'm neither a T1 or a doctor but I'm curious why you were hesitant to correct the 178? Or is the issue that when you wake up with great BG, it's not clear how much insulin to take to prevent the spike?

skypeace likes this.
__________________
Pumping insulin since 2017
Daytona is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Dawn's Phenomenon? herbmom Diabetes Forum Lounge 7 07-17-2013 05:53
Dawn Phenomenon LizR Diabetes 30 03-01-2013 15:36
*(DP)Dawn Phenomenon* Terrie Diabetes Symptoms 4 01-28-2013 06:58
What is the dawn phenomenon? Zuko Diabetes Diet and Nutrition 21 02-25-2012 07:25
Dawn Phenomenon - Can it be 'cured' ? Scarlet Phantom Diabetes 13 07-22-2011 12:37

LEGAL NOTICE
By using this Website, you agree to abide by our Terms and Conditions (the "Terms"). This notice does not replace our Terms, which you must read in full as they contain important information. You must not post any defamatory, unlawful or undesirable content, or any content copied from a third party, on the Website. You must not copy material from the Website except in accordance with the Terms. This Website gives users an opportunity to share information only and is not intended to contain any advice which you should rely upon. It does not replace the need to take professional or other advice. We have no liability to you or any other person in respect of any content on this Website.


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 05:30.




Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.1.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.