Questions about Metformin and other things

Go Back   The Diabetes Forum Support Community For Diabetics Online > Diabetes Forum Community > Diabetes

Diabetes This section of the forum can be used to discuss anything and everything to do with Diabetes. Please use this general Diabetes section for any comments or discussions that don't fit into the more specific forum categories below. Please also ensure that all posts and threads are on topic, about Diabetes.


Like Tree10Likes

Questions about Metformin and other things


Closed Thread
 
Shared Thread Thread Tools
Old 06-04-2013, 16:01   #1
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 784

Member Type
Type Undiagnosed
Diagnosed in 1900

144 likes received
373 likes given
Default Questions about Metformin and other things

I've thought of some things that I cannot find answers for directly so I thought I would come to the experts:

1. Will metformin cover up if one has gone from pre D to full D?

2. Taking Metformin should be with biggest meal of the day even if that is breakfast or is supper best?

3. Why is fasting the last to go as I heard with testing?

4. Can you feel it when you go from Pre D to full D?

5. Should I try to ward off DP by eating something or is it harmless?

6. Is it necessary to check fasting every morning if fasting is the last to go?

Thanks so much in advance. I'm sure I have a ton of other questions yet but these are the main ones that are weighing on my mind.

puppydfh is offline  
Old 06-04-2013, 17:44   #2
Active Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 8,607


10903 likes received
1862 likes given
Default

Sorry but I don't use any medication - and hope to stay that way - so, I can't say anything useful about Metformin.

What I will say is that the concept of "pre-diabetes" is a nonsense. There is no magic line of transition from "normal" to "pre" to "diabetes". Once your pancreas stops managing your glucose/insulin relationship automatically and your blood sugar numbers move out of the "normal" range you should take the opportunity of grabbing manual control immediately. Don't wait for the official diagnosis which almost always comes too late.

So, no, you will not detect any change as you slip down the slope into full diabetes.

In general the change in your blood sugar starts with your post meal figures as these slip with your failing phase 1 response. Your phase 2 response will keep you going but as it has to work hard to get you down to somewhere approaching normal, there's nothing left "in the bank" and slowly, your fasting figure will creep upwards.

When you take control, you will generally see much the same pattern. Your post meal figures will improve leaving scope for your weakened insulin response to slowly correct your fasting numbers. But basically you have to keep on top of it for the rest of your life.

The Dawn Phenonomen is a pest. There is no simple answer. Sometimes having a low carb snack will help but I have found that my body doesn't get awkward as long as I give it breakfast at its usual time. Delay eating in the morning, and up goes the number.

donnaB likes this.
John.in.France is offline  
Old 06-04-2013, 17:51   #3
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 784

Member Type
Type Undiagnosed
Diagnosed in 1900

144 likes received
373 likes given
Default

John Thank You So Much for the nice response. My question back would be about the pre diabetes diagnoses and are you saying there is not such thing? My Dr. says because I have not yet anyway gone over 200 that I am still prediabetes. I fear that day that I may go over 200 and will surely be saddened and disappointed in myself that I didn't grab the bull by the horn enough or more so then I am trying at the moment and deem myself a failure. Maybe someone else will answer the metformin questions and you've certainly given me a very good answer. thank you.

puppydfh is offline  
 
Old 06-04-2013, 18:00   #4
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 784

Member Type
Type Undiagnosed
Diagnosed in 1900

144 likes received
373 likes given
Default

John as a thought about the fasting DP. You are so correct that if you do not eat right away it goes. I've seen my fasting go from a nice 85 to a mean 109 in an hours time. I've tried to eat just a slice of cheese or something light but that didn't help it either. So now I just get up and test and eat except this morning I woke up at 4 and couldn't get back to sleep, so tired today but I've held my numbers good. I use to take a thyroid pill every morning so had to wait that hour and see it go up as I was always curious how much of a jump it would make and now I take thyroid pill at night so I can freely get up and eat if I want to. Most days I like to wait an hour or so to even eat but some evenings I try not to eat after 7 ish and I wake up starving. I'm still trying to find that right nitch.

puppydfh is offline  
Old 06-04-2013, 19:02   #5
Active Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 8,607


10903 likes received
1862 likes given
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by puppy View Post
...because I have not yet anyway gone over 200 that I am still prediabetes.
That is the official ADA standard. However, I stick to my guns. The line of 200 mg/dL was drawn entirely for political reasons. Have a look at this Misdiagnosis By Design - The Story Behind the ADA Diagnostic Criteria

In exactly the same way the concept of "pre-diabetes" or as it is sometimes described "glucose intolerance" depends entirely on arbitrary lines that do not really reflect our body's way of working. To use a rather poor computer analogy, our bodies are analogue machines and treating them as digital devices frequently will get a very sad result. We call it poor control!

silvertiger likes this.
John.in.France is offline  
Old 06-04-2013, 19:10   #6
Senior Member
 
silvertiger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Saskatchewan, Canada
Posts: 3,861

Member Type
Type Pre
Diagnosed in 2011

4282 likes received
5061 likes given
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by puppy View Post
I've thought of some things that I cannot find answers for directly so I thought I would come to the experts:

1. Will metformin cover up if one has gone from pre D to full D?

2. Taking Metformin should be with biggest meal of the day even if that is breakfast or is supper best?

3. Why is fasting the last to go as I heard with testing?

4. Can you feel it when you go from Pre D to full D?

5. Should I try to ward off DP by eating something or is it harmless?

6. Is it necessary to check fasting every morning if fasting is the last to go?

Thanks so much in advance. I'm sure I have a ton of other questions yet but these are the main ones that are weighing on my mind.
1. You're at full D, your numbers are just on the lower end of the scale. Being pre-diabetic is like being a little bit pregnant.

2. I take my Met in the AM when I get up and in the PM before I go to bed. If you are having tummy issues with it you could take it at breakfast and supper or with food. It isn't overly time dependent other than that.

3. Your BG is always going to be lower when you haven't eaten for a while. Eventually if you develop D, you may get the Dawn Phenomenon where your liver dumps glucose in the AM and finally makes your BG go up, but by the time that happens you've probably already been spiking past 140 after carby meals.

4. See question 1.

5. If it doesn't go over 140 then you don't have to worry too much, it should go down as you eat lower carb. However, if you do want to eat any carbs with breakfast, it is important to know your BG before eating so you don't go over 140.

6. I only check fasting in order to determine if I can have any carbs with breakfast. I have found I can eat 30g carbs per meal if I start out at 5.5 or less, and still end up under 7. But you might be different, so taking your BG and watching your meter is key.

puppydfh likes this.
__________________

View silvertiger's full Diabetes Forum profile here.
silvertiger is offline  
Old 06-04-2013, 19:54   #7
Senior Member
 
Mary,'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 6,071

Member Type
Type 2
Diagnosed in 2013

5574 likes received
5676 likes given
Default

I think what we're trying to say, too, is that there is no difference other than standard diagnostic criteria between 199 and 200. Let's say you've gone to 199 yet ADA diagnosis begins at 200. Your body doesn't turn in any way, at the moment you've hit 200 just because it's a diagnosis number. Really, there's no difference between that 199 and 200 other than a labeled diagnosis. If you're too high, you're too high, plain and simple. You're out of the boundary for what a normal blood sugar is, regardless of the label used.

puppydfh likes this.
__________________

View Mary0110's full Diabetes Forum profile here.
Mary, is offline  
Old 06-05-2013, 00:28   #8
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 784

Member Type
Type Undiagnosed
Diagnosed in 1900

144 likes received
373 likes given
Default

thank you for your reply. I'm confused as to why you say "you are D" when according to the standards if not over 200 then still borderline d. I read the full article from john and I am amazed that some "committee" can determine where we are suppose to be according to Pima Indians. That was quite a test they did and it seems that a 200 bg equates to a fbg of 126 and I've never had a fasting fbg past 109. Its ok though I guess I feel better not being called a D to myself I mean but I am trying very hard to eat low carb but about 20 carbs a meal too is what I can handle.
This is confusing but interesting to learn about and educate myself about. Thank you for the help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by silvertiger View Post
1. You're at full D, your numbers are just on the lower end of the scale. Being pre-diabetic is like being a little bit pregnant.

2. I take my Met in the AM when I get up and in the PM before I go to bed. If you are having tummy issues with it you could take it at breakfast and supper or with food. It isn't overly time dependent other than that.

3. Your BG is always going to be lower when you haven't eaten for a while. Eventually if you develop D, you may get the Dawn Phenomenon where your liver dumps glucose in the AM and finally makes your BG go up, but by the time that happens you've probably already been spiking past 140 after carby meals.

4. See question 1.

5. If it doesn't go over 140 then you don't have to worry too much, it should go down as you eat lower carb. However, if you do want to eat any carbs with breakfast, it is important to know your BG before eating so you don't go over 140.

6. I only check fasting in order to determine if I can have any carbs with breakfast. I have found I can eat 30g carbs per meal if I start out at 5.5 or less, and still end up under 7. But you might be different, so taking your BG and watching your meter is key.

puppydfh is offline  
Old 06-05-2013, 00:42   #9
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 784

Member Type
Type Undiagnosed
Diagnosed in 1900

144 likes received
373 likes given
Default

Well since you put it that way then yes I see your point.
I guess I do actually consider myself a D or I would not be here and be trying to eat like a D and taking Metformin as well.
I guess there is something scary about being a true D versus a Pre D. It means different things to me in my head whereas if still considered pre D then I don't feel as sick to my stomach about it. I cant explain it but maybe you know what I mean.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mary0110 View Post
I think what we're trying to say, too, is that there is no difference other than standard diagnostic criteria between 199 and 200. Let's say you've gone to 199 yet ADA diagnosis begins at 200. Your body doesn't turn in any way, at the moment you've hit 200 just because it's a diagnosis number. Really, there's no difference between that 199 and 200 other than a labeled diagnosis. If you're too high, you're too high, plain and simple. You're out of the boundary for what a normal blood sugar is, regardless of the label used.

Mary, likes this.
puppydfh is offline  
Old 06-05-2013, 00:46   #10
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 784

Member Type
Type Undiagnosed
Diagnosed in 1900

144 likes received
373 likes given
Default

This was a really fascinating article and I read the whole thing like I was spell bound. I learned a lot and thank you for showing me that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John.in.France View Post
That is the official ADA standard. However, I stick to my guns. The line of 200 mg/dL was drawn entirely for political reasons. Have a look at this Misdiagnosis By Design - The Story Behind the ADA Diagnostic Criteria

In exactly the same way the concept of "pre-diabetes" or as it is sometimes described "glucose intolerance" depends entirely on arbitrary lines that do not really reflect our body's way of working. To use a rather poor computer analogy, our bodies are analogue machines and treating them as digital devices frequently will get a very sad result. We call it poor control!

puppydfh is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Things to try Panther256 Diabetes Diet and Nutrition 14 07-06-2013 16:36
Dr. Put me on one 500 MG pill of Metformin per day, and I have questions! AbbySciuto Diabetes 11 06-07-2013 17:55
Things are looking bright mlooper Diabetes 8 02-22-2013 09:56
Things to consider Adjitater Diabetes 25 08-04-2011 00:21
Some things I just don't get Adjitater Diabetes 8 10-26-2010 23:04

LEGAL NOTICE
By using this Website, you agree to abide by our Terms and Conditions (the "Terms"). This notice does not replace our Terms, which you must read in full as they contain important information. You must not post any defamatory, unlawful or undesirable content, or any content copied from a third party, on the Website. You must not copy material from the Website except in accordance with the Terms. This Website gives users an opportunity to share information only and is not intended to contain any advice which you should rely upon. It does not replace the need to take professional or other advice. We have no liability to you or any other person in respect of any content on this Website.


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:44.




Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.1.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.