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Discussion Starter #1
You guys who've been here the longest already know this stuff, but I figured I would post it for the newbies to the disease and to the forum. It's an article about the ADA and their acceptance of funds from junk food companies, and my favorite part is the top "science" guy at the ADA saying that sugar has "nothing to do" with diabetes.

I have my second diabetes class on Saturday - the "nutrition" class - and I plan to print this article and pass it out to the class in front of the instructor. I'll probably have to stay after class and clap erasers as punishment! :p

American Diabetes Association peddling nutritional nonsense while accepting money from manufacturer of candy and sodas
 

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I think many of us have discovered that the ADA has hidden motives . First they recomend an HbA1c of 7.0 which is an average bg of 150. They also believe 180 after meals is find. When I was handed my little ADA food booklet by my dietician and saw all this processed food that was supposedly safe to eat, I was shocked. I only went once to my diabetes education, that was enough. Everything I learned I learned on my own with my meter or from online sites. It is a shame though that new diabetics are told these foods are ok. Some people don't even realise that spenda does have carbs and can spike you.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I think many of us have discovered that the ADA has hidden motives . First they recomend an HbA1c of 7.0 which is an average bg of 150. They also believe 180 after meals is find. When I was handed my little ADA food booklet by my dietician and saw all this processed food that was supposedly safe to eat, I was shocked. I only went once to my diabetes education, that was enough. Everything I learned I learned on my own with my meter or from online sites. It is a shame though that new diabetics are told these foods are ok. Some people don't even realise that spenda does have carbs and can spike you.

I wish that I had the option of skipping the nutrition class, but if I don't go to all three, my insurance company will make me pay for the course myself. I don't know how I'm going to get through Saturday without exploding.

As for the Splenda, according to Dr. Bernstein, the packets are the ones with the extra carbs, but if you buy it in bulk (not in packet form) it is okay.
 

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If you buy the bag of Splenda in bulk, it is bulked up with maltodextrin which is a form of sugar. This is a trick most sweetners use. When baking I count splenda 24 grams per cup. Recently I have been experimenting using a little splenda and some stevia. The only safe one is the liquid splenda. Now, these are the things they sould be teaching in your class. They should also teach you that bread spikes people more than sugar usually.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
If you buy the bag of Splenda in bulk, it is bulked up with maltodextrin which is a form of sugar. This is a trick most sweetners use. When baking I count splenda 24 grams per cup. Recently I have been experimenting using a little splenda and some stevia. The only safe one is the liquid splenda. Now, these are the things they sould be teaching in your class. They should also teach you that bread spikes people more than sugar usually.
I dont use any sweetener at all, I'm afraid it might lead me back into some of my old ways. Even today I found myself fondling a box of chocolate granola bars in the market. As for the class, the first one I had this past Saturday was just with the educator who was of course pushing the ADA's assertion that white stuff is okay for diabetics. When I said no, it wasn't, she literally rolled her eyes at me. I'll mae sure to bring earplugs and a comic book to hide in my diabetes manual on Saturday since it'll basically be a waste of 3 hours of my life. :p
 

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Not defending ADA, but making the observation that the dateline on that article is June 1, 2005

Most of us are aware of the failings of the ADA, but we also need to be aware of forum policy regarding defamatory posts (#14)
 

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I have to agree with Shanny. Let us not forget that the ADA simply gives basic guidelines for healthy eating. That doesn't mean that you will not have to make adjustments to your personal diet to get the numbers you want. And just to make it clear thr ADA says a serving of carbs is 15 grams so 5 or 6 servinggs is not all that much. I know I eat 6 or 7 servings of carbs a day. Although they recomend fruits and vegitables on seperate lines on the pyramid you still have to count the carbs in them in your carbs load. The other thing is not all meat products are carb free. Also remember that proteins eventually are turned into glucose by your body. So my recomendation is to find what works for you and to make note of it but not to expect what works for you to work other or for others to agree with you.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I have to agree with Shanny. Let us not forget that the ADA simply gives basic guidelines for healthy eating. That doesn't mean that you will not have to make adjustments to your personal diet to get the numbers you want. And just to make it clear thr ADA says a serving of carbs is 15 grams so 5 or 6 servinggs is not all that much. I know I eat 6 or 7 servings of carbs a day. Although they recomend fruits and vegitables on seperate lines on the pyramid you still have to count the carbs in them in your carbs load. The other thing is not all meat products are carb free. Also remember that proteins eventually are turned into glucose by your body. So my recomendation is to find what works for you and to make note of it but not to expect what works for you to work other or for others to agree with you.
Sorry, but I have to disagree with both of you. The article is not defamatory if it's the truth. The ADA recommends super-high blood sugars and AIC's of 7. That's enough to kill people. They need to be called out on their actions. Too many people have the old-school mentality that if it's an "organization" then of course they're experts and shouldn't be questioned. These are the people who need to know the truth about what is being preached to them.
 

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All I said was that we need to be cognizant of forum policy & not get too combative in our rantings. If you'd like, Rosie, I could refer this to our administrator for arbitration, but the fact remains that the mission of this website is support for one another, not crusading for the demise of the ADA.
 

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Please do refere it to the admintrator. If it keeps going I will be the one getting kicked off.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Please do refere it to the admintrator. If it keeps going I will be the one getting kicked off.
Okay, I don't know what's going on here, but it's getting a bit silly. All I'm trying to do is help inform new diabetics because I hate to see people being taken advantage of by a corporation. I'm not trying to start a war. It's only a diabetes forum, not the War Room.

I will step aside and not come back. Bye, all. Thanks for all the info.
 

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You guys who've been here the longest already know this stuff, but I figured I would post it for the newbies to the disease and to the forum. It's an article about the ADA and their acceptance of funds from junk food companies, and my favorite part is the top "science" guy at the ADA saying that sugar has "nothing to do" with diabetes.

I have my second diabetes class on Saturday - the "nutrition" class - and I plan to print this article and pass it out to the class in front of the instructor. I'll probably have to stay after class and clap erasers as punishment! :p

American Diabetes Association peddling nutritional nonsense while accepting money from manufacturer of candy and sodas
Well the name is only going on the diet products and not on the regular products so let's not take things out of context. And if the JDRF can put their name on products why can't the ADA to raise money? While I agree that processed foods are not healthy for anyone for some people that is all that is available. I do agree that healthy eating habits begin in the home however and that jcandy and pop machines shouldn't be allowed in schools.
 

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The thing about funding is, it can create additional obligations on the side. And I think many of us can see evidence for that in our insurance policies. So knowing the source is vital info for our own assessment.

Just had my Diabetes Basics class. First time I'd been a physical space full of Type 2s. It was a large class.

Most were newbies. A couple of folks had been diagnosed years ago, but wanted updated info, and/or had just started taking The D seriously.

Aside from the lone Type 1, I was the only attendee on insulin (folks gasped when I said that -- oops). I'd guess about 1/4-1/3 of us knew how to use a meter.

Of course, the instructor taught to the ADA Guidelines. It's clear my hospital plan requires it.

I decided to sit back and observe. Only thing I said was that the ADA guidelines do not work for me. The instructor was sympathetic, and suggested I look into the glycemic index.

Some impressions (and some conclusions):

-- ADA guidelines are a bit complex but, psychologically speaking, easy to teach to overwhelmed newbies.

-- ADA's recommended blood levels are, well, appalling. Post-prandial of up to 180, anyone?
(For some of us, that's the most realistic goal ... to begin with. But not for long. A schedule of descending goals would be far healthier.)

-- The ADA diet's a pretty healthy one for non-Ds. Maybe it works for an unknown number of Ds, too. But for so many of us -- NO.
(But it may work as a "Starter Diet," or as one of several diet options geared toward individual goals.)

-- One barrier to offering real options and individualized care is that, like everyone else, health providers are cutting their budgets. Follow-up and education get chopped. Ultimately, it's the patients who pay the price.

What I really object to is the pushing of ADA Guidelines as the sole authority. Personally, however, I've found my own medical team supports me doing my thing, as long as they are assured I know what I'm doing.

But not all patients have An Attitude. Heck, I wouldn't have one, were it not for a sudden hospital stay, horrific numbers and a host of nagging symptoms.

Granted, An Attitude always helps. But ... it should never be required for adequate care.
 

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The thing about funding is, it can create additional obligations on the side. And I think many of us can see evidence for that in our insurance policies. So knowing the source is vital info for our own assessment.

Just had my Diabetes Basics class. First time I'd been a physical space full of Type 2s. It was a large class.

Most were newbies. A couple of folks had been diagnosed years ago, but wanted updated info, and/or had just started taking The D seriously.

Aside from the lone Type 1, I was the only attendee on insulin (folks gasped when I said that -- oops). I'd guess about 1/4-1/3 of us knew how to use a meter.

Of course, the instructor taught to the ADA Guidelines. It's clear my hospital plan requires it.

I decided to sit back and observe. Only thing I said was that the ADA guidelines do not work for me. The instructor was sympathetic, and suggested I look into the glycemic index.

Some impressions (and some conclusions):

-- ADA guidelines are a bit complex but, psychologically speaking, easy to teach to overwhelmed newbies.

-- ADA's recommended blood levels are, well, appalling. Post-prandial of up to 180, anyone?
(For some of us, that's the most realistic goal ... to begin with. But not for long. A schedule of descending goals would be far healthier.)

-- The ADA diet's a pretty healthy one for non-Ds. Maybe it works for an unknown number of Ds, too. But for so many of us -- NO.
(But it may work as a "Starter Diet," or as one of several diet options geared toward individual goals.)

-- One barrier to offering real options and individualized care is that, like everyone else, health providers are cutting their budgets. Follow-up and education get chopped. Ultimately, it's the patients who pay the price.

What I really object to is the pushing of ADA Guidelines as the sole authority. Personally, however, I've found my own medical team supports me doing my thing, as long as they are assured I know what I'm doing.

But not all patients have An Attitude. Heck, I wouldn't have one, were it not for a sudden hospital stay, horrific numbers and a host of nagging symptoms.

Granted, An Attitude always helps. But ... it should never be required for adequate care.
My diabetes class must have been rare because they told me to not be above 140 after a meal and then they said to look for no more than a 40 point rise max and that is what I started with. Of course there was a good mix of people with type 1 and type 2 and type 1.5 and other causes of diabetes such as missing pancreases, etc. I think any class is a good starting place though. Then if the person is able they can either come here or some other diabetes forum to learnr more and grow. A person has to start somewhere right?
 

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My diabetes class must have been rare because they told me to not be above 140 after a meal and then they said to look for no more than a 40 point rise max and that is what I started with. Of course there was a good mix of people with type 1 and type 2 and type 1.5 and other causes of diabetes such as missing pancreases, etc. I think any class is a good starting place though. Then if the person is able they can either come here or some other diabetes forum to learnr more and grow. A person has to start somewhere right?
Don't know if your class was rare ... but you totally lucked out!

I was given the same ADA Guidelines in the hospital ... along with a high-carb diet that, as an in-patient, I could not change. I was not encouraged to look elsewhere for answers.

I'm in an HMO (managed care). It includes hospital and all Drs. They definitely have a playbook ... and I understand the need for one. But, infinite hassle though it is, all playbooks need updates on occasion.

I've since learned that at least some hospitals in other states provide the same good info you got, and offer meal variations as well. Haven't done a real study, so I don't know if ADA-only is an HMO thing, or a statewide regulatory thing.

I've come to know a number of diabetics who simply accept the ADA rules without question. For some, those rules seem to work. Good! But a couple of them -- veteran diabetics -- are happy when they can keep under 200, and advised me to do the same, and not try to go lower.

Not everybody is inclined to explore further. Many, due to innate ability or life circumstances, aren't able to. Some folks simply Do As They're Told.

A class that provides proper tools and encouragement is far better than one that does not.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Don't know if your class was rare ... but you totally lucked out!

I was given the same ADA Guidelines in the hospital ... along with a high-carb diet that, as an in-patient, I could not change. I was not encouraged to look elsewhere for answers.

I'm in an HMO (managed care). It includes hospital and all Drs. They definitely have a playbook ... and I understand the need for one. But, infinite hassle though it is, all playbooks need updates on occasion.

I've since learned that at least some hospitals in other states provide the same good info you got, and offer meal variations as well. Haven't done a real study, so I don't know if ADA-only is an HMO thing, or a statewide regulatory thing.

I've come to know a number of diabetics who simply accept the ADA rules without question. For some, those rules seem to work. Good! But a couple of them -- veteran diabetics -- are happy when they can keep under 200, and advised me to do the same, and not try to go lower.

Not everybody is inclined to explore further. Many, due to innate ability or life circumstances, aren't able to. Some folks simply Do As They're Told.

A class that provides proper tools and encouragement is far better than one that does not.
I met the same type of people in my first Diabetes class last Saturday. They all accept the ADA and feel grateful to be under 200. I showed them my journal with my days under 110 and they were all shocked. 'I don't get it, how'd you do that?' 'By not listening to the ADA, I told them'. And the instructor, who did not appreciate my big mouth. :heh:
 

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Rosie if you read Richard Bernstein's book, The Diabetes Solution, he gives a LOT of backstory on how diabetes historically has been detected, and treated. It really gave me some insight into why the groupthink persists. It really helped me explain WHY I should eat to my meter instead follwoing any prescribed diet, whatsoever.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Rosie if you read Richard Bernstein's book, The Diabetes Solution, he gives a LOT of backstory on how diabetes historically has been detected, and treated. It really gave me some insight into why the groupthink persists. It really helped me explain WHY I should eat to my meter instead follwoing any prescribed diet, whatsoever.
My favorite book!! :D
 

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Some people don't even realise that spenda does have carbs and can spike you.
I guess I'm one of those people. I haven't noticed any spikes, but I don't check my sugar after every time I use it. I guess it would make sense, though. "Tastes like sugar because it's made from sugar." I was just thinking about that today. I thought about trying Truvia. What is stevia? How does it taste?

I'm still trying to figure all this out. :confused:
 
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