[goo_stewart]

Ok folks, I know all about the dawn effect, my kind liver dumping sugar into my system to prepare for the day ahead, but I am experiencing an annoying trend in my BG levels since I stopped my meds.

I stopped taking the meds (on Dr advice) and my BG has been reasonably normal, a few spikes when I am trying new things or not paying attention, but things are reasonably normal. I am mostly keeping under 110 within 1.5 hours of lunch and dinner. In the day time. It is the morning that I have problems. I am seeing a steady rise in my BG in the morning. I am recording steadily higher numbers. This morning was the highest - 146.

Now, the numbers are going down as soon as I get active in the morning and by 8am I am seeing the number down to 110 again. Is there anything I can do to counter this annoying dawn effect? Is there any subtle tricks I can play on my body? I am aware that the liver dump occurs at about 5am. I am in bed until 5:30/6:00. I know this because I have tested myself throughout the night. Last night I went to bed at 9:30pm with a BG of 116, this morning it is 146! Anyone help me with some tips?

I could go back on the meds, but they were not really reducing my numbers by that much, they were usually keeping my morning numbers to 120. Maybe I should just take the meds at night? Would that be a solution to this?

Can I thank all that read and answer this forum, I have learnt a lot and am feeling great, mostly down to the things I have learnt on here.

 

[jwags]

The only thing that helped my dawn phenomenom was to take the maximum amount of metformin. I take it in 3 doses with the last dose right before bed around midnight. I take another dose the minute I wake up. Some people find having a late night snack of fat and protein helps. Things like avacado, cheese, peanut butter, cracker with coconut oil, etc. The other thing you could try is waking up a little earlier and eat a few nuts or a protein snack to stop the DP. With the metformin my morning bgs go as low as mid 80's-100 some mornings. Are you eating a lower carb diet? That will also help with DP.

 

[thcri]

did I read someplace that Vinegar Tablets help withe the Dawn Phenomenom??

 

[joe_h]

is it 1 bad reading or more? if it's just one I wouldn't worry that much about it. could be almost anything.as stated above metformin is supposed to help w/ DP and so is a small snack before bed so your body doesn't think you're starving to death and dumping glucose into your bloodstream. I'm on met and have a glass of red wine before bed and that help my AM numbers (this works for me and I'm not your doc)

 

[goo_stewart]

Ok, this morning was a little better at 136. I ate a salad and pork chop at 6pm and then nothing else afterwards. I am on a very low carb diet, unless I go for exercise.

I have been having a series of these bad readings. I have been low at 110 since I came off the meds, but am randomly getting higher numbers. Tonight I will try a small snack of peanuts before bed (no vinegar tablets available until I can get to a pharmarcy - even then I am a little unsure if my limited translations will be undertood). I will be eating earlier and will keep at the low low carb diet.

Thanks folks.

 

[breezeonby]

A small dose of Lantus or Levemir before bedtime would help bring your fasting blood glucose down.

 

[jwags]

I've tried the ACV tablets and have mixed results. Sometimes they worked sometimes they don't. Some find drinking a little ACV with the mother in it helps delay spikes at meals. I tried drinking it in some tea, boy was it nasty. I think drizzling it on salad would be a better idea. Try it and see if it works. DP is a multi headed monstor, lots of different treatments may work for awhile. My doctor never warned me about DP and when I asked him about it he said it was rare. Well, I'm on 4 different forums and it seems like a very common problem, especially with type 2's.

 

[Checochinican]

I cheat by not testing early, wait until mid-morning. I can get away with that, not being a breakfast eater.

When to test is another controversial subject; I've read some authors who say fasting blood glucose is more important, others say postprandial results are more reliable.

 

[goo_stewart]

This morning I was 128 when I tested at the regular time. I think eating early may be the key. I might try the ACV on my salad as well, that is very doable.

 

[newface]

I cant tell the last time my number was below 200 in the morning. I think i am a walking time bomb

Ok folks, I know all about the dawn effect, my kind liver dumping sugar into my system to prepare for the day ahead, but I am experiencing an annoying trend in my BG levels since I stopped my meds.

I stopped taking the meds (on Dr advice) and my BG has been reasonably normal, a few spikes when I am trying new things or not paying attention, but things are reasonably normal. I am mostly keeping under 110 within 1.5 hours of lunch and dinner. In the day time. It is the morning that I have problems. I am seeing a steady rise in my BG in the morning. I am recording steadily higher numbers. This morning was the highest - 146.

Now, the numbers are going down as soon as I get active in the morning and by 8am I am seeing the number down to 110 again. Is there anything I can do to counter this annoying dawn effect? Is there any subtle tricks I can play on my body? I am aware that the liver dump occurs at about 5am. I am in bed until 5:30/6:00. I know this because I have tested myself throughout the night. Last night I went to bed at 9:30pm with a BG of 116, this morning it is 146! Anyone help me with some tips?

I could go back on the meds, but they were not really reducing my numbers by that much, they were usually keeping my morning numbers to 120. Maybe I should just take the meds at night? Would that be a solution to this?

Can I thank all that read and answer this forum, I have learnt a lot and am feeling great, mostly down to the things I have learnt on here.

 

[beefy]

This morning I was 128 when I tested at the regular time. I think eating early may be the key. I might try the ACV on my salad as well, that is very doable.

Keep in mind that it's possible that eating earlier doesn't actually stop your liver dump, but causes it to happen earlier in the morning and thus allows your body to burn off some of it before you wake and test...

... at least that's what happens with me. The only way I personally prevent liver dump is eating a very small amount of carb with some protein and/or fat either very late at night, or very early in the morning. Based on my own experience, if I fast (even sleeping) more than 6 hours in a row, I will dump. As such, I have a tendency lately to wake up around 3:30am and have a snack, then go back to bed.

Unfortunately, for some people, there is currently no other way to prevent the dawn phenomenon. As BreezeOnBy mentioned though, a small dose of lantus or similar insulin does help some folks.

 

[HardBackStrider]

Keep in mind that it's possible that eating earlier doesn't actually stop your liver dump, but causes it to happen earlier in the morning and thus allows your body to burn off some of it before you wake and test...

... at least that's what happens with me. The only way I personally prevent liver dump is eating a very small amount of carb with some protein and/or fat either very late at night, or very early in the morning. Based on my own experience, if I fast (even sleeping) more than 6 hours in a row, I will dump. As such, I have a tendency lately to wake up around 3:30am and have a snack, then go back to bed.

Unfortunately, for some people, there is currently no other way to prevent the dawn phenomenon. As BreezeOnBy mentioned though, a small dose of lantus or similar insulin does help some folks.

Beefy how low do you go before you liver kicks in I was at 3.3 this morning just before eating and was at 5.8 before bed last night when I ate some tomatoes and a good handful of almonds. I would really like to figure a very typical routine to do. I definitely have to get my carburetor fine tuned as it's running a bit rough these days.

 

[gabbi513]

I have also been struggling with high numbers in the morning; or should I say higher than I would like them to be. Normally high 120's sometimes into the 130's depending on what my evening meal had consist of but these last two weeks I've added a new supplement. Not only have my morning #'s lowered (the highest was 108 in a two week period and that was AFTER excercise...normally I test before) plus I have dropped 5 lbs and a total of nine inches. I'm a believer and am looking forward to actually reversing this disease.:cheer2:

 

[Shanny]

And what is the new supplement?! Enquiring minds want to know!

 

[saleaaway]

what does an aspirin do for BG numbers? Never heard of that

 

[Shanny]

what does an aspirin do for BG numbers? Never heard of that

I don't know that aspirin affects BG, but some of us still follow the old one-a-day baby aspirin therapy for heart health.

Welcome to DF, saleaaway :wave:

 

[saleaaway]

I don't know that aspirin affects BG, but some of us still follow the old one-a-day baby aspirin therapy for heart health.

Welcome to DF, saleaaway :wave:

thanks
Just to give a bit of background I'm not on any meds.. All diet and excersize. I started at 7.5 and last bloodwork in June I was down 28 pounds and my A1C was at 6.0. Since the weather has changed and even though I have AC the heat bothers me something crazy. I found myself having horrible hot flashes in the middle of the night so bad that I went back on my estrogen. My numbers in themorning were up in the 140's. Now they are in the 120's but to me still high. I've done everything I can think of. Eating a snack at night, no snack. Protien no protein,, carbs no carbs.
Someone told me that disrupted sleep has an affect as well and I'm up at least four times during the night.
My goal is to stay off meds as long as I can but I'm nervous that I'm headed down that path if I can't get the DP under control.
I appreciate the comments.
Thanks Elaine

 

[pgreeff]

I cheat by not testing early, wait until mid-morning. I can get away with that, not being a breakfast eater.

When to test is another controversial subject; I've read some authors who say fasting blood glucose is more important, others say postprandial results are more reliable.

Interesting comment... When I was diagnosed I was told that skipping meals was not an option. I never used to eat breakfast. As for test times, I have stuck to testing when I wake up, before and two hours after meals.

 

[pgreeff]

My doctor has recommended that I take Diamicron once a day in addition to Glucophage after each main meal. I'm considering taking Diamicron in the evening instead of the morning. Do you think this would help to counter the dawn phenomenon? Since I am already taking 500mg of Glucophage after supper so I can't really make a change in that, can I?

 

[Shanny]

Since Diamicron isn't marketed in the US where I live, I have no experience with it, but I've been on metformin (Glucophage) for two years and have switched around the timing of those doses several times. I now take 1000mg in the morning & 1500mg in the evening. Nothing seems to squelch my dawn phenomenon except waking early to test before it gets started. Then I can eat a few almonds to head it off, whereupon I go back to bed! (old retired person that I am )

This is the first chance I've had to welcome you to DF, since I've been on vacation for awhile, so thank you for joining us - it's great to have you here!