How much insulin do the type IIs here take?

14689 Views 13 Replies 7 Participants Last post by lorah39, May 12, 2011

c.scoleri

Discussion Starter · Sep 9, 2009

Hello! I have been type II for a couple decades, almost. I was doing the oral meds exclusively. The last few years my numbers were really bad, A1C of about 12. Then I had pancreatitis and got put on insulin (I will never know why my doc didn't put me on it previously, after 3 years of impossible to control blood glucose...)

So now I'm on insulin. For the first few months it was great. A1C down to 6. But I was gaining weight. I was on about 35 units of Lantus at night, and wound up taking about 36 units of Novolog throughout the day.

So now I've gained 40 pounds. I am not totally blaming the insulin as I did do the whole "wow, I don't have to starve myself anymore, I can have dessert, I just need to take my insulin" deal. It was a huge difference to not have to panic over every little thing I ate... But I don't think I did 40 lbs of damage with that attitude. I did do two months of vegetarian + dairy and still gained 15 pounds during those two months... Anyway.

Now I'm taking 75 units of Lantus at night, and my overall daily intake of Novolog is around 150 units, and that's if I try to limit my calories. If we go out to eat or if I am hungrier and eat more, I might have to take 200 units of Novolog. I am no longer gaining weight and in fact I lost a few pounds so I'm not totally pigging out or anything... Just eating normally, no desserts typically.

However I can't seem to get my blood glucose down... My fasting readings are around 250. My two hour post prandial readings, even after having taken 35 or so units to cover the meal, are over 300, sometimes over 350. I've started taking more to try to prevent this from happening, and I do certainly take extra when I test and see that I'm still so high. But it's scary! Every so often something like this will happen:

230 before eating, take 25 units
eat
260 one hour post
300 two hours post
take 30 units
275 an hour later
270 thirty minutes later
take 25 units
250 an hour later
take 20 units
220 an hour later
do nothing
two hours later, I'm at 35!

So, as I'm sure you all know, that sucks. I am sure I have a ton of insulin resistance from being type II anyway and from the weight gain. I have asked my doctor for help. He is really clueless. He won't refer me to an endocrinologist and has refused my request to be referred for the last few years, saying none he works with are taking new patients. I've tried getting with one on my own as my insurance allows me to go to anybody. But they won't take me without a referral from a GP. I AM going to do something about that even if it means taking a trip to the ER one night when my blood glucose is high and I can't get it down.

But in the meantime, what is up? Is it like this for any of you other type IIs on insulin? Am I taking an insane amount of insulin or is this just how it is for a lot of type IIs? I've asked my doctor for a protocol to lower my sugars and to hopefully avoid going hypo, but he really has no clue what I'm talking about. He just keeps saying I need to calculate the right amout of insulin to take based on the carbs I'm about to eat, and frankly, there does not seem to be any sort of noticable correlation.

The scenario I detailed above has only happened twice. Usually it's more like I test that last time and I'm still at 240 so I just give up. I am terrified of the sudden unexpected hypo incidents. When I first got on insulin I had several really bad ones where I had fallen and was confused and blacking out - that was when I was trying to maintain really tight control, and when I was not as fat so I was more sensitive. But the last two I had (months after I used to have them when I first started), I really had pretty much no symptoms. I had just happened to test to see where I was at and see if I needed yet another dose of insulin... I know the more that happens the more likely it is it'll happen without symptoms, which is not good.

So is this bad or is this just par for the course? I mean I know it's bad but what can be done other than losing weight and hoping sensitivity gets better? What type of control can a fat type II really hope to have? It seems I have no idea how any given dose of insulin is going to affect me. I also asked my doctor if there is a problem injecting into my fat tummy... It almost seems like the tummy is so fat, the insulin I inject just sits there, blocked from going anywhere by all the fat. He said he doesn't think that's possible.

Oh I was back on metformin for a month and a half and I swear my blood glucose was worse, harder to control, which makes no sense... It makes me bloated and gives me diarrhea so I don't like to take it, and if it's not even going to help, then I don't see a reason to be on it.

Well, thanks for reading, and I look forward to hearing from anybody about how much insulin you have to take and if it affects you in a unpredictable manner like it does me. It is a total pain!

take care
cindi

See less See more

Save

Status: Not open for further replies.

1 - 14 of 14 Posts

beetal

· #2 · Sep 9, 2009

Dear Cindi,
First of all i would like to tell you that i am no expert.What i am telling you here is only my view about what u r facing.
I feel that you are loading yourself with very high amount of insulin which is working quite delayed.
I personally feel that you should be taking some dosage of metformin and lesser amount of insulin.and you should also match the right amount of fast acting and delay acting insulin.
I think you should discuss this aspect with your GP.
And i am very sure that it will give better results..
You surely need to add metformin in your system and reduce weight.
Take care

c.scoleri said:
Hello! I have been type II for a couple decades, almost. I was doing the oral meds exclusively. The last few years my numbers were really bad, A1C of about 12. Then I had pancreatitis and got put on insulin (I will never know why my doc didn't put me on it previously, after 3 years of impossible to control blood glucose...)

So now I'm on insulin. For the first few months it was great. A1C down to 6. But I was gaining weight. I was on about 35 units of Lantus at night, and wound up taking about 36 units of Novolog throughout the day.

So now I've gained 40 pounds. I am not totally blaming the insulin as I did do the whole "wow, I don't have to starve myself anymore, I can have dessert, I just need to take my insulin" deal. It was a huge difference to not have to panic over every little thing I ate... But I don't think I did 40 lbs of damage with that attitude. I did do two months of vegetarian + dairy and still gained 15 pounds during those two months... Anyway.

Now I'm taking 75 units of Lantus at night, and my overall daily intake of Novolog is around 150 units, and that's if I try to limit my calories. If we go out to eat or if I am hungrier and eat more, I might have to take 200 units of Novolog. I am no longer gaining weight and in fact I lost a few pounds so I'm not totally pigging out or anything... Just eating normally, no desserts typically.

However I can't seem to get my blood glucose down... My fasting readings are around 250. My two hour post prandial readings, even after having taken 35 or so units to cover the meal, are over 300, sometimes over 350. I've started taking more to try to prevent this from happening, and I do certainly take extra when I test and see that I'm still so high. But it's scary! Every so often something like this will happen:

230 before eating, take 25 units
eat
260 one hour post
300 two hours post
take 30 units
275 an hour later
270 thirty minutes later
take 25 units
250 an hour later
take 20 units
220 an hour later
do nothing
two hours later, I'm at 35!

So, as I'm sure you all know, that sucks. I am sure I have a ton of insulin resistance from being type II anyway and from the weight gain. I have asked my doctor for help. He is really clueless. He won't refer me to an endocrinologist and has refused my request to be referred for the last few years, saying none he works with are taking new patients. I've tried getting with one on my own as my insurance allows me to go to anybody. But they won't take me without a referral from a GP. I AM going to do something about that even if it means taking a trip to the ER one night when my blood glucose is high and I can't get it down.

But in the meantime, what is up? Is it like this for any of you other type IIs on insulin? Am I taking an insane amount of insulin or is this just how it is for a lot of type IIs? I've asked my doctor for a protocol to lower my sugars and to hopefully avoid going hypo, but he really has no clue what I'm talking about. He just keeps saying I need to calculate the right amout of insulin to take based on the carbs I'm about to eat, and frankly, there does not seem to be any sort of noticable correlation.

The scenario I detailed above has only happened twice. Usually it's more like I test that last time and I'm still at 240 so I just give up. I am terrified of the sudden unexpected hypo incidents. When I first got on insulin I had several really bad ones where I had fallen and was confused and blacking out - that was when I was trying to maintain really tight control, and when I was not as fat so I was more sensitive. But the last two I had (months after I used to have them when I first started), I really had pretty much no symptoms. I had just happened to test to see where I was at and see if I needed yet another dose of insulin... I know the more that happens the more likely it is it'll happen without symptoms, which is not good.

So is this bad or is this just par for the course? I mean I know it's bad but what can be done other than losing weight and hoping sensitivity gets better? What type of control can a fat type II really hope to have? It seems I have no idea how any given dose of insulin is going to affect me. I also asked my doctor if there is a problem injecting into my fat tummy... It almost seems like the tummy is so fat, the insulin I inject just sits there, blocked from going anywhere by all the fat. He said he doesn't think that's possible.

Oh I was back on metformin for a month and a half and I swear my blood glucose was worse, harder to control, which makes no sense... It makes me bloated and gives me diarrhea so I don't like to take it, and if it's not even going to help, then I don't see a reason to be on it.

Well, thanks for reading, and I look forward to hearing from anybody about how much insulin you have to take and if it affects you in a unpredictable manner like it does me. It is a total pain!

take care
cindi

Save

c.scoleri

Discussion Starter · #3 · Sep 9, 2009

Hi and thanks for the reply. I know you're not an expert and I won't just blindly follow something somebody on the internet tells me, so no worries.

But are you saying that the basic idea is type II diabetics on insulin are supposed to only take some amount of insulin, regardless of how high their blood glucose is? Like, if I've already taken however many units and I'm still testing at, say, 250 or whatever, I shouldn't take any more insulin to try to lower it? I've been under the impression I need to keep taking insulin and taking insulin and taking insulin until my blood glucose gets into an acceptable range.

Save

beetal

· #4 · Sep 10, 2009

HI! again..
See by what u r doing is ...you are loading your body with excess insulin whereas your body is not utilising it because of insulin resistence in your adipose tissues... say for example metformin helps in decreasing resistence in adipose tissues temperorily and helps whatever insulin is present in body to use it maximum. But in your case there is no agent helping to decrease resistence so when your body is overflooded with insulin and it forcefully starts utilising it....there is loads of insulin so you end up in hypo...
I am of very strong belief that you require metformin support with much lesser quantity of insulin

c.scoleri said:
Hi and thanks for the reply. I know you're not an expert and I won't just blindly follow something somebody on the internet tells me, so no worries. But are you saying that the basic idea is type II diabetics on insulin are supposed to only take some amount of insulin, regardless of how high their blood glucose is? Like, if I've already taken however many units and I'm still testing at, say, 250 or whatever, I shouldn't take any more insulin to try to lower it? I've been under the impression I need to keep taking insulin and taking insulin and taking insulin until my blood glucose gets into an acceptable range.

Save

Anthill

· #5 · Sep 11, 2009

Hello Cindi , I find that Insulin is getting the weight on but then I would look at getting to count Carbohydrates and exercise + Discipline!!! read labels in packed food. Yes it's a lot to take in as this will take time. Stick to it and get into physical activity that you like and raise the sweat!!! And drink water. Insulin doses are an individual thing that you have to fiddle with to get control and exercise will make you to throttle off the doses. As to start your exercise rotine, Go slowly!! And gain momentum. Also have with you gluco tabs or sweet things to get out of a low along with a water bottle and the Ipod.

Save

May

· #6 · Sep 11, 2009

I am sorry to interupt, I have a question. I thought that it wasn't that big of a deal to have a high blood sugar, certaintly not unless it is over long periods of time. Its the low sugar that will kill ya. So even if you cont. to have high sugars after your meds ....that's it, you have done what you can. Is that not right??? It seams thats been my Docs thing, he says I must not be doing enough of something else.

Save

Anthill

· #7 · Sep 12, 2009

May said:
I am sorry to interupt, I have a question. I thought that it wasn't that big of a deal to have a high blood sugar, certaintly not unless it is over long periods of time. Its the low sugar that will kill ya.

It's the reverse May, OK, Lows suck as that we can agree with. To have high BG's and have that for a good long piriod becomes acidic and slowly destroys your body and thin too as many a diabetic who are Type 1 can loose weight buy having high BG's. Later in life you will experience eye problems that will come first and many other too many to name of Complications.

So even if you cont. to have high sugars after your meds ....that's it, you have done what you can. Is that not right??? It seams thats been my Docs thing, he says I must not be doing enough of something else.

Click to expand...

I would look at ways to get BG's to a good level no matter what med's that you have. Or look at getting med's that will not interfere with BG's. If you are looking at weight loss then exercise is the key and stay away from fat in particular animal fat!! And look at good carbs that gives you energy, But if you don't do anything physically then carb counting is the only way to go.

Save

May

· #8 · Sep 13, 2009

Thanks that certaintly helps, is scary, but it helps

Save

Anthill

· #9 · Sep 13, 2009

I am sorry May as I can remember all too well as I was to thin and I was soooo hungry. Not fun to say the least Now I as fat as a whale and have the opposite effect. Moan Doctors are never happy with me.

Save

beetal

· #10 · Sep 14, 2009

I think we have moved away from main topic which te author of this thread pointed towards...

Anthill said:
I am sorry May as I can remember all too well as I was to thin and I was soooo hungry. Not fun to say the least Now I as fat as a whale and have the opposite effect. Moan Doctors are never happy with me.

Save

Anthill

· #11 · Sep 16, 2009

beetal said:
I think we have moved away from main topic which te author of this thread pointed towards...

Maybe, I would think that whatever carbs that you eat is too much unless you put that to good use. Look at the management with the scales, As there is 3 trays. Food (Carbs), Insulin, Exercise. and the Exercise is what we don't do enough of.

Save

Lloyd

· #12 · Sep 21, 2009

c.scoleri said:
Hello! I have been type II for a couple decades, almost. I was doing the oral meds exclusively. The last few years my numbers were really bad, A1C of about 12. Then I had pancreatitis and got put on insulin (I will never know why my doc didn't put me on it previously, after 3 years of impossible to control blood glucose...)

So now I'm on insulin. For the first few months it was great. A1C down to 6. But I was gaining weight. I was on about 35 units of Lantus at night, and wound up taking about 36 units of Novolog throughout the day.

So now I've gained 40 pounds. I am not totally blaming the insulin as I did do the whole "wow, I don't have to starve myself anymore, I can have dessert, I just need to take my insulin" deal. It was a huge difference to not have to panic over every little thing I ate... But I don't think I did 40 lbs of damage with that attitude. I did do two months of vegetarian + dairy and still gained 15 pounds during those two months... Anyway.

Now I'm taking 75 units of Lantus at night, and my overall daily intake of Novolog is around 150 units, and that's if I try to limit my calories. If we go out to eat or if I am hungrier and eat more, I might have to take 200 units of Novolog. I am no longer gaining weight and in fact I lost a few pounds so I'm not totally pigging out or anything... Just eating normally, no desserts typically.

However I can't seem to get my blood glucose down... My fasting readings are around 250. My two hour post prandial readings, even after having taken 35 or so units to cover the meal, are over 300, sometimes over 350. I've started taking more to try to prevent this from happening, and I do certainly take extra when I test and see that I'm still so high. But it's scary! Every so often something like this will happen:

230 before eating, take 25 units
eat
260 one hour post
300 two hours post
take 30 units
275 an hour later
270 thirty minutes later
take 25 units
250 an hour later
take 20 units
220 an hour later
do nothing
two hours later, I'm at 35!

So, as I'm sure you all know, that sucks. I am sure I have a ton of insulin resistance from being type II anyway and from the weight gain. I have asked my doctor for help. He is really clueless. He won't refer me to an endocrinologist and has refused my request to be referred for the last few years, saying none he works with are taking new patients. I've tried getting with one on my own as my insurance allows me to go to anybody. But they won't take me without a referral from a GP. I AM going to do something about that even if it means taking a trip to the ER one night when my blood glucose is high and I can't get it down.

But in the meantime, what is up? Is it like this for any of you other type IIs on insulin? Am I taking an insane amount of insulin or is this just how it is for a lot of type IIs? I've asked my doctor for a protocol to lower my sugars and to hopefully avoid going hypo, but he really has no clue what I'm talking about. He just keeps saying I need to calculate the right amout of insulin to take based on the carbs I'm about to eat, and frankly, there does not seem to be any sort of noticable correlation.

The scenario I detailed above has only happened twice. Usually it's more like I test that last time and I'm still at 240 so I just give up. I am terrified of the sudden unexpected hypo incidents. When I first got on insulin I had several really bad ones where I had fallen and was confused and blacking out - that was when I was trying to maintain really tight control, and when I was not as fat so I was more sensitive. But the last two I had (months after I used to have them when I first started), I really had pretty much no symptoms. I had just happened to test to see where I was at and see if I needed yet another dose of insulin... I know the more that happens the more likely it is it'll happen without symptoms, which is not good.

So is this bad or is this just par for the course? I mean I know it's bad but what can be done other than losing weight and hoping sensitivity gets better? What type of control can a fat type II really hope to have? It seems I have no idea how any given dose of insulin is going to affect me. I also asked my doctor if there is a problem injecting into my fat tummy... It almost seems like the tummy is so fat, the insulin I inject just sits there, blocked from going anywhere by all the fat. He said he doesn't think that's possible.

Oh I was back on metformin for a month and a half and I swear my blood glucose was worse, harder to control, which makes no sense... It makes me bloated and gives me diarrhea so I don't like to take it, and if it's not even going to help, then I don't see a reason to be on it.

Well, thanks for reading, and I look forward to hearing from anybody about how much insulin you have to take and if it affects you in a unpredictable manner like it does me. It is a total pain!

take care
cindi

When your glucose is high, due to insufficient insulin (and in a T2, that is caused at least in part, by resistance), your body tries to clear the high glucose by making you thirsty so you will drink more, spilling the sugar in your urine, and it turns some of the excess glucose into triglycerides, which are stored as fat.

When you inject or infuse the necessary insulin so that you no longer have a shortage, the level of glucose in your blood goes down and the spillage stops.

This means your body processes food more efficiently. Herein lies the problem, you will usually need to eat less than you are used to, or you gain weight. Weight gain when put on insulin is very common, for the above reason and also "Now I can eat this, I'll just bolus for it."

When I went on an insulin pump, I lowered my daily carbohydrate intake from 180 a day to 80, and lost 35 pounds (which I needed to lose) over the next 8 months and have kept it off for 2 years.

It's not a problem with insulin, your body is just working efficiently again, and you have a newly recovered chance to overeat.

As an experiment, with my doctors ok, I stopped metformin (about 2 years ago). My insulin requirements went up a little each day, until at 3 weeks I needed twice as much insulin as when I was taking metformin, and even that was not enough.

I went back on Metformin and my insulin usage returned to normal.

-Lloyd

See less See more

Save

Reactions: 1

breezeonby

· #13 · Jan 13, 2010

I gained 40 pounds in 4 months after restarting my use of insulin. I take 94 units of lantus at bedtime and take Novolog before meals and to correct high readings. I take about 75 units of Novolog per day. My blood sugar readings are good. Search the internet for an a endocrinologist. Call your local diabetes association or the ADA about doctors in your area. You will find someone to see you without a referral. Good luck.

Save

lorah39

· #14 · May 12, 2011

having the same problem

im having the same problem. i keep gaining weight wich makes my blood higher so i take more insulin wich makes me gain more weight its a visious cycle. wish i know what to do to help you. all i can do is be here for you to talk to if you need to talk to someone with the same problem. hugs.

Save

1 - 14 of 14 Posts

Status: Not open for further replies.

Top Contributors this Month