[Strawberry]

When it comes to the LCHF way of eating, how do you figure the proper amount of protein? I am not good with mathematics and my Doctor has advised me to not eat 'too much protein'. She also cautioned me to eat enough protein for energy.

Currently I am spilling protein into my urine and I would like to reverse that if possible. I just don't know enough about this way of eating to make an intelligent choice.

I rarely eat red meat and I prefer beans, chicken, turkey or fish. My Dad who was also diabetic suffered kidney complications because of poor control. I want to avoid that if possible.

Can anyone suggest reading material that might help clarify this type of information?

 

[optimist]

In Norway we learns that you need between 1 gram and 2,5 gram for each kilo bodymass depending on how active you are.
I am not active and eat about 50 gram of protein each day (my weight is 48 kilo)
My son who is an active longdistance runner needs to eat about 170 gram of protein each day. His weight is 64 kilo.

 

[tony0611]

As per Dr Bernstein the amount is about 1gm per kg of body weight... I am currently having about 80 to 100 gms per day...

And you can have a look at one of my threads where I was worried about spilling protein into my urine. Apparently dietary protein is not related to protein in the urine. That's what people here and my doctor said

Here's the link

http://www.diabetesforum.com/diabetes-forum-lounge/6948-test-results-2-months-post-dx-good-bad.html

And then in my next tests the protein had gone..

http://www.diabetesforum.com/diabet...-months-post-diagnosis-more-improvements.html

My doctor said that spilling protein is caused by sustained high HbA1C and once you keep it low for a while it normally goes away...

Infact if you are worried about kidney damage Dr Bernstein also says in his book that by managing blood sugars a lot of early kidney damage can be reversed...

Tony

 

[Strawberry]

Optimist - Let me see if I understand this correctly? If I weighed 56 kilo, then I would need approximately 56 grams of protein??

This might be easy to figure out when eating food that is already prepared and has a nutrition label, but not so easy when fixing food at home, right?

 

[jwags]

I don't know if there is an exact formula but I try to eat about 15-20 grams per meal. So that is 2-3 oz of meat. Most servings of nuts are 6-8 g of protein. Sometimes I use whey powder but I stick to 1/2 a scoop which is about 13 carbs.

 

[Strawberry]

As per Dr Bernstein the amount is about 1gm per kg of body weight... I am currently having about 80 to 100 gms per day...

And you can have a look at one of my threads where I was worried about spilling protein into my urine. Apparently dietary protein is not related to protein in the urine. That's what people here and my doctor said

Here's the link

http://www.diabetesforum.com/diabetes-forum-lounge/6948-test-results-2-months-post-dx-good-bad.html

And then in my next tests the protein had gone..

http://www.diabetesforum.com/diabet...-months-post-diagnosis-more-improvements.html

My doctor said that spilling protein is caused by sustained high HbA1C and once you keep it low for a while it normally goes away...

Infact if you are worried about kidney damage Dr Bernstein also says in his book that by managing blood sugars a lot of early kidney damage can be reversed...

Tony

To say I'm worried about kidney damage is an understatement. In reading all of the posts in the links you provided for me - I just realized how little I really know in spite of the fact I was diagnosed back in 2003.

I can say without a doubt that NO doctor ever told me how to control triglycerides. What they did was to give me a statin drug and send me on my way. Over a period of 3 years the statin drug brought down my other levels but not the triglycerides. I would always get scolded, but I never knew how to fix it because they never told me.

It seems that most of you are close to normal weight, so what does someone like me who is obese do for consuming protein. Using the conversion factor found on the Internet it seems like I would be consuming an enormous amount of protein.

One day clear out of no where I woke up in such pain that I could barely walk. To make a long story short - I ended up stopping the statin drug and I truly believe the doctors gave up on me. It has been 4 years since my cholesterol was checked. I mean, what are they going to do for me if my level is still high? I refuse to take another statin drug and at that point I had never heard of LCHF.

Sigh......all of this information is a lot to absorb. Think I will crawl off in my own little corner of the world and try to make sense of all of this. My A1C done in June 2011 was 6.8%, and the one done in December 2011 was 6.1%. I also wanted to break into the 5% club, but not this time I guess. I'm wondering if the 5% is harder for type 1, but I know several type 1 people who are that fortunate.

My Doctor nearly had fits when I was disappointed with the 6.1%. I'm not going to mention trying to go any lower or it will just be another 'lecture'.

Thank you for your replies, I really appreciate your time.

 

[beefy]

It seems that most of you are close to normal weight, so what does someone like me who is obese do for consuming protein. Using the conversion factor found on the Internet it seems like I would be consuming an enormous amount of protein.

You still need adequate protein, regardless of your weight. It should be a minimum of 10-15% of your calories - more if you're active. For those of us (like myself) who are quite active, I can eat well-over 35% of my calories from protein, because I need it for tissue repair, etc.

Instead of looking at the grams per Kg of body-weight formula, look instead to percentage of calories. Start with about 15% and tailor it as you need... That's my suggestion.

It's always best to keep things simple if if you can. I'm good with complicated formulas, but not everyone is an idiot savant like I am.

 

[Strawberry]

You still need adequate protein, regardless of your weight. It should be a minimum of 10-15% of your calories - more if you're active. For those of us (like myself) who are quite active, I can eat well-over 35% of my calories from protein, because I need it for tissue repair, etc.

Instead of looking at the grams per Kg of body-weight formula, look instead to percentage of calories. Start with about 15% and tailor it as you need... That's my suggestion.

It's always best to keep things simple if if you can. I'm good with complicated formulas, but not everyone is an idiot savant like I am.

Beefy,

I would definitely consider myself to be sedentary, much to my embarrassment. So if my suggested calories for the day are 1200, I should have 10% or less of that amount for my protein? I also have to be honest and say that math is my worst subject

 

[skb]

Like jwags has said, numbers & formulas would have you pretty confused. If you are interested in LC/HF here's what the arithmetic is like ;

The P : C : F ratios should be 1 : 0.5 : 3
To calculate the protein gms use your body weight in lbs & deduct 100
From that you can easily calculate the gms of carbs & fats

People generally focus on the fats & the other two fall in line pretty well.

Hope this helps.

 

[jwags]

I was also on statins for almost 2 years until they almost killed me. I took myself off them and never looked back. I haven't checked my cholesterol since then. So I understand your frustration. The whole protein thing is confusing. On one site you read if you don't eat enough protein your muscles will be canabalized. But many of us get more protein than we think. Things like nuts, almond flour, greek yogurt, beans, peanut butter all have protein. So it is not just meat that has protein. Whey protein is an easier digested protein and may be an option if you don't want to do more meat. I tend to eat a protein bar like Atkins once or twice a day so I know I get at least 20 grams of protein in them. I think that is probably whey or soy protein.

 

[Spunky]

I can say without a doubt that NO doctor ever told me how to control triglycerides. What they did was to give me a statin drug and send me on my way. Over a period of 3 years the statin drug brought down my other levels but not the triglycerides. I would always get scolded, but I never knew how to fix it because they never told me.

Most of us who have adopted the low carb/high fat way of eating find that our lipids take care of themselves. When we have our blood test every 3 months, my husband and I find that our cholesterol, LDL and triglycerides have fallen and our HDL has risen.

 

[Shanny]

Our experience is the same . . . overall lipids stabilize, but LC/HF is apparently lethal on triglycerides. They really drop like a rock.

 

[tony0611]

Well my trigs fell from 232 to about 120 in three months on an "unhealty" high fat diet !!

Actually the new emerging concepts are the high fat diet can/may cause high lipid only when the high fat is accompanied with a "normal" high carb diet

 

[optimist]

Optimist - Let me see if I understand this correctly? If I weighed 56 kilo, then I would need approximately 56 grams of protein??

This might be easy to figure out when eating food that is already prepared and has a nutrition label, but not so easy when fixing food at home, right?

If you are not active, it would be just fine with 56 grams of protein.
In the beginning I weighed my food and counted how much carbo, fat and protein there is in my food (I make all my food at home), and after I did that for some time, I learned how much meat I should eat, or how many eggs or which amount of beans I could have.
Now I dont weigh my food each time, but sometimes I take a little test to see if I still has it right.

 

[Daytona]

My doctor (a bariatric physician, specializing in obese patients) follows the recommendations of Drs. Mike and Mary Eades. The important point is that your body needs protein to maintain/build your lean body mass (muscle/bone/organs) so the amount of protein that you need is not based on your total weight, % of calories, etc and can be calculated from your lean body mass.

Though if you are diagnosed with kidney damage/disease, your doctor should help you come up with your protein requirements.

I wrote an article on this, here's the info on how to calculate your protein requirements:

1. Write down your weight.
2. Figure out your body fat %. You can use an impedance meter, calipers or just guess using the internet.
3. Multiply your weight by 1 - your body fat %. For example if your body fat % is 30%, multiply by 0.7. This is your lean body mass.
4. Now multiply your lean body mass by 0.8. This is the low-end of your protein range in grams. Your high end is your lean body mass in grams. If you aren't very active, start out at the low-end, if you are very active then go for the high end.

Here's an example:

1. Sue weighs 190 lbs.
2. Her body fat % is 40%.
3. So her lean body mass is 190 * 0.6 = 114 lbs.
4. Sue's protein range is 114 * 0.8 = 91 g to 114 g. So she aims for at least 30g of protein per meal.

Some quick tips for estimating protein:
* 1 oz of meat is usually 7g of protein
* 1 egg is about 7g of protein
* 1 cup of cooked kidney beans is 15g of protein

 

[Strawberry]

Our experience is the same . . . overall lipids stabilize, but LC/HF is apparently lethal on triglycerides. They really drop like a rock.

The office of my new GP has the capability of electronic records, so I was able to look back and see my last lipid panel that was done. Some numbers are not good, others ...not too bad. Overall, I'm not sure what they mean.

Cholesterol 257.....<200 range
Triglycerides 69....<150
HDL 60....>40
LDL 183....<130
VLDL 14....10-50
Chol/HDL ratio 4.3....0-4.4

I'm wondering if I try harder on the LCHF if the bad numbers would improve?

 

[beefy]

The office of my new GP has the capability of electronic records, so I was able to look back and see my last lipid panel that was done. Some numbers are not good, others ...not too bad. Overall, I'm not sure what they mean.

Cholesterol 257.....<200 range
Triglycerides 69....<150
HDL 60....>40
LDL 183....<130
VLDL 14....10-50
Chol/HDL ratio 4.3....0-4.4

I'm wondering if I try harder on the LCHF if the bad numbers would improve?

Your trig's are great. No concern there.

Generally speaking, most people that follow LCHF find that their HDL will increase, LDL decrease and Cholesterol drop.

so yes, it's very likely that your numbers will improve.

If you haven't already, check out Dr. Andreas Eenfeldt's LCHF page: LCHF for beginners | Dietdoctor.com

 

[beefy]

Beefy,

I would definitely consider myself to be sedentary, much to my embarrassment. So if my suggested calories for the day are 1200, I should have 10% or less of that amount for my protein? I also have to be honest and say that math is my worst subject

I'd also like to point out that unless you're extremely tiny, you suggested calories for the day would never be 1,200.

I can't remember (if you told us) your age and weight, but 1200 calories is the BMR of a 55 year old 110 lb woman... meaning it's what you'd need if you were a 110 lb woman on 24/7 bedrest...

If you're younger or heavier, that calorie requirement goes up considerably.

For calories, I like to use a calculator like this one. There's two steps,

1. Enter your personal information (Sex, Age, Weight, Height) in the boxes in the left column;

2. Estimate your activity in the boxes on the right column, and click "Calculate". (Don't over-estimate your activity.)

Then it gives you both your BMR (your daily caloric need if on bedrest) and your activity calories.

Once you have those numbers (which is for your CURRENT weight) change the "weight" figure to what you think your optimum healthy weight is.

If dieting, try to be no lower than the calorie needs at your HEALTHY weight. If you drop lower than that intake, your body will not want to burn fat properly.

Your daily intake of exact calories isn't as important as your intake of MINIMUM calories - although you certainly don't want to eat too much on a regular basis. But if you don't get enough calories even for your healthy weight, you will have a very hard time losing weight.

Hope that helps.

 

[Strawberry]

It is hard for me to wrap my head around the idea that I need 'more calories' in order to lose weight. I am 66 years old and have spent the better part of my adult life as a person who is overweight. Doctors have told me to cut my calories down to about 1000 to 1200. When the weight didn't come off, they then would accuse me of "cheating". In spite of the fact I didn't cheat, the weight stayed on.

When I was first diagnosed with diabetes the doctor I had then told me "it is your fault because if you weren't fat, you wouldn't have diabetes". He never did get around to explaining to me why my Mother had it and she was not fat, and my Dad did have it and he was also like me.

I want to do the LCHF the right way, one thing bothers me though. I've noticed the majority of folks on the forum who follow this way of eating are Type 2. I must weigh my food or else I don't know how much insulin to take. I don't have a choice about not taking it. It keeps me alive. In my limited understanding of LCHF I've already seen a 20% reduction in my insulin requirement which is a good thing.

 

[Spunky]

It is hard for me to wrap my head around the idea that I need 'more calories' in order to lose weight. I am 66 years old and have spent the better part of my adult life as a person who is overweight. Doctors have told me to cut my calories down to about 1000 to 1200. When the weight didn't come off, they then would accuse me of "cheating". In spite of the fact I didn't cheat, the weight stayed on.

I am 67 and you and I have been indoctrinated for a lot of years to believe that it is calories that cause us to gain or lose weight, that is probably the reason it has been so hard for us to wrap our heads around the idea that carbs are the culprit. But now that we know, all I have to say is, we can eat lots of great tasting stuff and still lose weight, ain't it grand?!

I've noticed the majority of folks on the forum who follow this way of eating are Type 2.

I believe LCHF is the healthiest way for anyone to eat, whether they have diabetes or not, and even moreso if they want to lose weight.