I am seeing a very noticeable drop in my blood glucose levels over the last 3 days, including my fasting numbers. Unfortunately, I added 3 things (Berberine, Milk Thistle, and apple cider vinegar) into my daily routine, so I have no way of knowing which one is making a difference or if it is the combination of all three.
Testing Metformin + Berberine Together
I know we have discussed Berberine as a replacement for Metformin (for some people) but I am curious if any of y'all have tried them together?
First let me explain why I am asking. As most of you know, I live a Keto lifestyle and take Metformin to control my diabetes. My diabetes is 99% under control. My last A1C was 6.2. The one issue that continue to perplex me, are my morning numbers. I have tried just about everything to control the dawn phenomenon, with very little success. Additionally, my numbers in the morning will continue to climb until I give in and eat or drink my version of bullet proof coffee.
Yes, I realize I could give in and go on insulin, but I would rather not.
I have been doing some research on Berberine and found some articles that taking Berberdine AND Metformin may improve control.
I am going to start testing results with taking both and see if it makes any difference in my morning numbers.When taken together, Metformin and berberine seem to work synergistically for even better glucose control. Surprising supplements: Five effective nutrients you've never heard of | Precision Nutrition
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Sounds silly, but it could very well be all three. I wouldn't cut one out and if things started back the other way, think that that's the one that is working. If you really want to find out, you would probably let them all clear out then do a 3 day trial with each individually, with a clear out in between. Follow that with doing combinations of two at a time, and then back to all three together.
Since my diagnosis, I have NEVER seen good fasting numbers like I am right now.Sounds silly, but it could very well be all three. I wouldn't cut one out and if things started back the other way, think that that's the one that is working. If you really want to find out, you would probably let them all clear out then do a 3 day trial with each individually, with a clear out in between. Follow that with doing combinations of two at a time, and then back to all three together.
Everything BUT my fasting numbers were great before. (Waking up to 109 which is well below my norm for consecutive fasting numbers.)
I am scared to change ANYTHING right now. Hopefully the last three days haven't been just a fluke. I will continue to monitor and see if this new trend continues.
You could always wait a few months, then eliminate one and see if there's any change.
That is a good idea. I am actually happy that I tired them all together because if it turns out it was the combination of all 3 making the difference, I would have never known, so I am gonna go with your idea. Wait a few months then start dropping one by one to see what happens.You could always wait a few months, then eliminate one and see if there's any change.
As I look back to the early days, it is amazing to me how far I have come.
My journey began with an ambulance ride to the hospital, when my daughter called 911 because she thought I was having a stroke. When I was admitted, AFTER the first dose of insulin, my blood sugar was still pushing 400. At that time, I was also eating what I thought was a healthy diet and walking anywhere between 5-10 miles a day. I remember the nutritionist coming in and explaining how I needed to eat 30-45 carbs at EVERY meal. Needless to say, every appointment after my discharge I was sicker than the appointment before and each appointment led to more and more drugs. I remember thinking that if this was going to be life, I didn't know how I could deal with it every day.
And then I discovered LCHF and a later on, KETO...
I mean it when I say, that I believe LCHF/KETO saved my life.
My journey began with an ambulance ride to the hospital, when my daughter called 911 because she thought I was having a stroke. When I was admitted, AFTER the first dose of insulin, my blood sugar was still pushing 400. At that time, I was also eating what I thought was a healthy diet and walking anywhere between 5-10 miles a day. I remember the nutritionist coming in and explaining how I needed to eat 30-45 carbs at EVERY meal. Needless to say, every appointment after my discharge I was sicker than the appointment before and each appointment led to more and more drugs. I remember thinking that if this was going to be life, I didn't know how I could deal with it every day.
And then I discovered LCHF and a later on, KETO...
I mean it when I say, that I believe LCHF/KETO saved my life.
Okay, this could be pure coincidence, but last night, I completely forgot to drink some apple cider vinegar before going to bed.
Guess what?
My blood sugar was higher this morning.
Still testing...
Guess what?
My blood sugar was higher this morning.
Still testing...
Gosh apple cider vinegar would have been first on my list to cut out! I just don't like the taste of it. Please keep us posted. X
I wasn't a fan of it at first either, I just usually mix a teaspoon or two in a large glass of water and sip on it at night while I am winding down.Gosh apple cider vinegar would have been first on my list to cut out! I just don't like the taste of it. Please keep us posted. X
I heard you can buy them in capsule form too though.
Just an update while I continue to test this...
Last Night Bedtime: 87
This Morning: 89
In the past, if I chose not to eat something (or drink Bullet Proof Coffee) after waking up, my blood sugar would continue to rise until I did so.
So I decided not to eat anything just to see if it would remain.
1 hour later after not eating: 100
Another hour later: 110
So I decided to eat something. Jimmy Dean Simple Scrambles (Meat Lovers) 2 carbs
One hour later: 94
Last Night Bedtime: 87
This Morning: 89
In the past, if I chose not to eat something (or drink Bullet Proof Coffee) after waking up, my blood sugar would continue to rise until I did so.
So I decided not to eat anything just to see if it would remain.
1 hour later after not eating: 100
Another hour later: 110
So I decided to eat something. Jimmy Dean Simple Scrambles (Meat Lovers) 2 carbs
One hour later: 94
I am loving these numbers, especially the fasting ones.
I am hoping this means I have found a solution (for me) for dawn phenomenon, as long as I break my fast every morning....
I am hoping this means I have found a solution (for me) for dawn phenomenon, as long as I break my fast every morning....
That would be wonderful, Cricket, after your struggle with it. Persistence pays off!
FYI update on my testing, removal of any of the 3 supplements appears to raise my morning numbers - not quite as high as they were before, but higher than using all 3 together.
One more update on attempts not to eat in the morning, or at least have my version of bullet proof coffee - This morning I decided to try to wait it out (one last time) to see if it would eventually stop going up (my numbers). I finally gave up when it hit 130+ after starting from 94. So at least for me, for some unknown reason, my liver apparently loves to spew glucose at me if I don't eat.
So for now, I will just keep doing what I am doing.
One more update on attempts not to eat in the morning, or at least have my version of bullet proof coffee - This morning I decided to try to wait it out (one last time) to see if it would eventually stop going up (my numbers). I finally gave up when it hit 130+ after starting from 94. So at least for me, for some unknown reason, my liver apparently loves to spew glucose at me if I don't eat.
So for now, I will just keep doing what I am doing.
I'd stick to a good thing too Cricket. It's interesting this experiment. Thank you for sharing that with us. Although my A1c seems to be ok..i still struggle with dawn phenonomen. Wonder if the body actually thinks it's starving by the morning and the liver kicks in for glucose as it thinks we need energy, you would think the LCHF way of eating would counteract that, so I'm wondering a fat bomb before bed? It's just a thought. I'll try it and get back to you.
This is just my thought (I could be totally wrong!) but I think that one reason we may find differences between us (for those who experience dawn phenomenon or don't get great results from fasting) is that each of us may have different secondary issues.I'd stick to a good thing too Cricket. It's interesting this experiment. Thank you for sharing that with us. Although my A1c seems to be ok..i still struggle with dawn phenonomen. Wonder if the body actually thinks it's starving by the morning and the liver kicks in for glucose as it thinks we need energy, you would think the LCHF way of eating would counteract that, so I'm wondering a fat bomb before bed? It's just a thought. I'll try it and get back to you.
As an example, I have a couple of growths on my thyroid and one on my pituitary gland, so some hormones may throw things off a bit. :vs_worry:
And I had hypothyroidism caused by Graves' disease...good point as my hormones are al over the paddock :vs_sad:This is just my thought (I could be totally wrong!) but I think that one reason we may find differences between us (for those who experience dawn phenomenon or don't get great results from fasting) is that each of us may have different secondary issues.
As an example, I have a couple of growths on my thyroid and one on my pituitary gland, so some hormones may throw things off a bit. :vs_worry:
I'll still try the fat bomb before bed thou, I have a theory on that.
Looove experimenting on myself :smile2:
I was on 4 met per day. Bothered my stomach. Went on 4 berberine per day. No met. Lowered bs from 8.4 to 6.5 in 3 months. Lowered colesterol 50 points and triglycerides by 40 points. I stomach problems. About to do fresh blood work. Anxious to see.
what is the op's version of bullet proof coffee? im interested,
also research reactive hypoglycemia because since we sleep we are not eating, we are going hypo in a way, and may contribute to dawn phenom, id suggest waking, sipping some oj first thing, then check ur numbers, or eat right away and then check, if u see that ur numbers drop AFTER u eat it may in fact be a form of hypoglycemia kicking in over night....
also research reactive hypoglycemia because since we sleep we are not eating, we are going hypo in a way, and may contribute to dawn phenom, id suggest waking, sipping some oj first thing, then check ur numbers, or eat right away and then check, if u see that ur numbers drop AFTER u eat it may in fact be a form of hypoglycemia kicking in over night....
OJ is loaded with carbs and sends my blood sugar through the roof. I live a fairly strict KETO lifestyle.what is the op's version of bullet proof coffee? im interested,
also research reactive hypoglycemia because since we sleep we are not eating, we are going hypo in a way, and may contribute to dawn phenom, id suggest waking, sipping some oj first thing, then check ur numbers, or eat right away and then check, if u see that ur numbers drop AFTER u eat it may in fact be a form of hypoglycemia kicking in over night....
Normally, my version of Bulletproof Coffee Includes:
- coffee
- coconut oil
- ceylon cinnamon
- granulated splenda
- butter (kerrygold)
- heavy whipping cream
More recently it has included:
- coffee
- ceylon cinnamon
- granulated splenda
- butter (kerrygold)
- heavy whipping cream
- brain octane oil (by bulletproof)
That being said, my morning number are much better now, as long as I don't forget to eat something or have my coffee - otherwise my liver kicks in and dumps all kinds of glucose.
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